Proposal about voting for plausible changes

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demeisen
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Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by demeisen »

In the "Alpha Discussion" thread the idea was raised to have a vote to present the uncategorized deluge of ideas in a more succinct and easily digested manner. Several posters expressed that they liked the idea.

I think this should be focused on plausible ideas. It's fine to want something like, "Throw out all the 3D enemy models and recreate them from scratch in a different style", but there's about zero chance of that happening, so it seems more productive to focus on things that don't discard huge amounts of work. The spirit here is to constructively find small to mid sized things to nudge what we've seen in directions we'd prefer, rather than a grousing session or asking for massive changes. Also, not bugs, just changes in how things work, or additions we want the most. The result guarantees nothing. The devs might ignore the list entirely :D. There's no entitlement or expectation to it, just constructive input.

I think this makes sense with a reasonable sized list of succinct one-liners. If there are two dozen variant phrasings of the same idea, that's no good. Also, better dozens of items than hundreds, since the point is to end up with a focused list of what we'd most like to see changed or added, rather than every random bit of minutia anyone happened to think up.

I'd like to propose a two phase vote. Phase one would collect and de-duplicate ideas. This would have a time window (a week?). Phase two, in its own thread, would be to vote for or against the items. A tally could be taken periodically.

To that end I went through the alpha thread and collected all the things I found which weren't clearly in the "throw out huge amounts of work and start over" category, and seemed plausible. Below is what I found, and since I may have missed some, we can augment (or trim) the list in phase one.

Also, we'd need a tally process. Initial proposal, which I wrote a small script to do, is to let each person have up to 10 upvotes (fewer is fine), and up to 5 downvotes (fewer is fine). Each person's top vote gets 10 points, next gets 9, and so on down to 1. So two people's middle-of-the-road +5 preference, is equivalent to one person having it as their top item, or ten people having it as their bottom item. However, upvoting something never hurts it, even if it's your bottom upvote. (One alternative tally system is given below).

The result of this would be a ranked set of succinct and unduplicated wants, to distill out which things are most important to the community.

Here are items I found in the alpha thread, to cut and paste into people's votes. Changing the '+' to a '-' casts a vote against instead of for. For example if you hate the idea of a random component to damage, you'd change the "+ Have minor RNG component to combat damage" item to "- Have minor RNG component to combat damage".
  • + Large dynamic spell selection / versatility (not <=5 at once)
  • + Elimination or style alteration of neon blue combat grid
  • + More complete/robust keyboard controls (especially in combat)
  • + Spells which may damage enemies from subsequent combat waves
  • + Remove/alter juvenile animations (e.g. butt wagging)
  • + Ensure node spacing large enough for practical/meaningful hand-mapping
  • + Have minor RNG component to combat damage
  • + Game mode to disable post-combat auto-resurrection. Spell/temple instead
  • + Chars which die in combat should receive no exp for that combat
  • + Semi-compelled random encounters. Chance modification from song/spell/etc
  • + Allow out of combat utility spells
  • + Restoration of dex/luck/con stats, with some meaning
  • + Enhanced difficulty (poster defeated two groups w/ lone PC)
  • + Trapped chests, with mitigation means (spells/rogues/etc)
  • + Optional scrolling combat log
  • + Most melee weapons should have 1 rank of range (maybe 2 for some, pikes etc)
  • + Option: PCs should not turn back to enemies (use other selection effect)
  • + PCs should always face player
  • + Noise / smashing walls should alert nearby enemies
  • + Being on fire should have negative status effect beyond DOT
  • + Long term SP pool (spell AP cost subtracts from, no casting when zero)
  • + Occasional anti-magic/anti-light zones
  • + Pitch black dungeons requiring light source (nice fit for UE4 engine)
  • + Don't lock voice packs to classes/races
  • + Use for unused AP (carry over half, and/or allow better defense)
  • + Per-character AP pool, rather than per party
  • + Auto-scale enemies with PC level
  • + No 'main' PC. Game start should allow creation of multiple PCs
  • + Character level should be more significant than equipment, esp on monks
Here's a Lua script to tally votes. You cut and paste forum text (all pages) into a text file, then run this script with that as stdin. It will reject multiple votes from a single author, so the final vote thread should have one post per author (but you could edit your post to change your vote). It also rejects duplicate votes for a given item by the same author. It also rejects unknown items, so you must cut/paste from the items phase 1 settles on. Then it implements the above tally scheme. It can be modified to new tally schemes as desired, but I think something fairly basic is best, like all upvotes count for +1, or maybe the 10-down-to-1 system.

Code: Select all

#!/usr/bin/env lua

local author_score = {}
local item_votes = {}
local in_author_block = false
local author = ''
local voted = {}           -- for rejection of multiple vote blocks from same author
local author_votes = {}    -- for rejection of duplicate items for a given author
local voter_count = 0      -- count of unique voters
local upvote_count = 0     -- total upvotes
local downvote_count = 0   -- total downvotes
local dupe_count = 0       -- count of voters with dupliate items
local unknown_count = 0    -- count of votes for unrecognized items
local excessive_count = 0  -- count of voters with excessive votes
local dupe_voter_count = 0 -- count of people posting more than one vote post
local format = false

for a = 1, #arg do
   if arg[a] == '--fmt' then
      format = true
   end
end

local item_data = {
   "Large dynamic spell selection / versatility (not <=5 at once)",
   "Elimination or style alteration of neon blue combat grid",
   "More complete/robust keyboard controls (especially in combat)",
   "Spells which may damage enemies from subsequent combat waves",
   "Remove/alter juvenile animations (e.g. butt wagging)",
   "Ensure node spacing large enough for practical/meaningful hand-mapping",
   "Have minor RNG component to combat damage",
   "Game mode to disable post-combat auto-resurrection.  Spell/temple instead",
   "Chars which die in combat should receive no exp for that combat",
   "Semi-compelled random encounters. Chance modification from song/spell/etc",
   "Allow out of combat utility spells",
   "Restoration of dex/luck/con stats, with some meaning",
   "Enhanced difficulty (poster defeated two groups w/ lone PC)",
   "Trapped chests, with mitigation means (spells/rogues/etc)",
   "Optional scrolling combat log",
   "Most melee weapons should have 1 rank of range (maybe 2 for some, pikes etc)",
   "Option: PCs should not turn back to enemies (use other selection effect)",
   "PCs should always face player",
   "Noise / smashing walls should alert nearby enemies",
   "Being on fire should have negative status effect beyond DOT",
   "Long term SP pool (spell AP cost subtracts from, no casting when zero)",
   "Occasional anti-magic/anti-light zones",
   "Pitch black dungeons requiring light source (nice fit for UE4 engine)",
   "Don't lock voice packs to classes/races",
   "Use for unused AP (carry over half, and/or allow better defense)",
   "Per-character AP pool, rather than per party",
   "Auto-scale enemies with PC level",
   "No 'main' PC. Game start should allow creation of multiple PCs",
   "Character level should be more significant than equipment, esp on monks",
   "Inactive characters get 10% of gained exp due to relating experiences"
}

local qol_improvements = {
   "Escape key should back out of screens",
   "PC positions should reset after combat",
   "Remove or alter loot chest animation (it's too exuberant / MMO-ish)",
   "Inventory GUI comparison popup between equipped and other item",
   "Move GUI combat controls out of middle of character grid",
   "Game option to disable repeated taunt audio",
   "Improve/clarify Ambushed! indication",
   "Minimize console-ization of UI where possible",
   "Minimize combat delays (e.g, blocking animations, or delays on Enemy's Turn text)",
}

-- initialize all item votes to 0
for k,v in pairs(item_data) do
   item_votes[k] = {key=k, vote=0, up_count=0, down_count=0}
end

-- Cheesy and slow: Find item for vote, returning index, or nil if not found.
local function find_item(txt)
   local prefix = txt:lower():sub(1, 25)

   for k,v in pairs(item_data) do
      if prefix == v:lower():sub(1,25) then
         return k
      end
   end

   return nil
end

-- Reverse table
local function reverse(tbl)
   for i=1, math.floor(#tbl / 2) do
      local tmp = tbl[i]
      tbl[i] = tbl[#tbl - i + 1]
      tbl[#tbl - i + 1] = tmp
   end
end

print("-------------------------------- Parse Log: --------------------------------")
print()

for line in io.stdin:lines() do
   -- Author leadin
   if line:match("^Post by") or line:match("^Unread post by") then
      local author_match = line:match(".*[Pp]ost by ([^»]+)")

      if author_match then
         author = author_match

         if voted[author_match] then
            print("Already voted: ", author)
            in_author_block = false
            dupe_voter_count = dupe_voter_count + 1
            goto continue -- emulate 'continue'
         else
            -- track that author voted, and reset scores for next.
            author_votes     = {}
            in_author_block  = true
            author_score[1]  = 10+1  -- max positive score: 10 (+1 for pre-decrement)
            author_score[-1] = 5+1   -- max negative score: 5 (+1 for pre-decrement)

            goto continue -- emulate 'continue'
         end
      end
   end

   -- don't count instructions as actual votes
   if line:match("^.*INSTRUCTIONS") then
      print("Discarding instructions post")
      in_author_block = false
      goto continue
   end

   -- skip to next author
   if not in_author_block then goto continue end

   -- look for votes
   local mul = nil

   local txt = line:match("^%s*[+]%s*(.*)")
   if txt then
      mul = 1
      upvote_count = upvote_count + 1
   else
      txt = line:match("^%s*[-]%s*(.*)")
      if txt then
         mul = -1
         downvote_count = downvote_count + 1
      end
   end

   -- Tally
   if mul then
      if not voted[author] then
         print("Counting votes: ", author)
         voter_count      = voter_count + 1
      end

      voted[author]     = true
      author_score[mul] = author_score[mul] - 1

      if author_score[mul] <= 0 then
         if author_score[mul] == 0 then
            excessive_count = excessive_count + 1
            in_author_block = false
            print("Vote underflow for", author)
         end

         goto continue -- emulate 'continue'
      end

      local vote = find_item(txt)

      if vote then
         if author_votes[vote] then
            print("Duplicate item for author", author, vote)
            dupe_count = dupe_count + 1
         else
            item_votes[vote].vote = item_votes[vote].vote + mul * author_score[mul]

            if mul > 0 then
               item_votes[vote].up_count = item_votes[vote].up_count + 1
            else
               item_votes[vote].down_count = item_votes[vote].down_count + 1
            end

            author_votes[vote] = true
            -- print("Vote: ", vote, mul, author_score[mul])
         end
      else
         print("Invalid vote item", txt)
         unknown_count = unknown_count + 1
      end

      goto continue
   end

   ::continue:: -- emulate "continue", which lua lacks natively
end

-- Sort votes by priority
local function compare_vote(a, b) 
   -- Primary sort: priority
   if a.vote ~= b.vote then return a.vote > b.vote end

   -- Secondary sort: vote count (upvotes - downvotes)
   local a_count = (a.up_count - a.down_count)
   local b_count = (b.up_count - b.down_count)

   if a_count ~= b_count then return a_count > b_count end

   -- Break final ties alphabetically
   return item_data[a.key] < item_data[b.key] -- break ties
end

table.sort(item_votes, compare_vote)

title1 = '[b]'
title2 = '[/b][' .. 'code' .. ']'  -- broken up to avoid forum sw parsing
title3 = '[' .. '/code' .. ']'     -- broken up to avoid forum sw parsing

-- Print vote data and tallies
print()
if format then print(title1) end
print("Vote Stats:")
if format then print(title2) end
print(voter_count,      "unique voter(s)")
print(string.format("%-7d total upvotes (%4.2f / voter)", upvote_count, upvote_count / voter_count))
print(string.format("%-7d total downvotes (%4.2f / voter)", downvote_count, downvote_count / voter_count))
print(unknown_count,    "unrecognized vote items")
print(dupe_count,       "duplicated votes")
print(excessive_count,  "voter(s) with more votes than permitted")
if format then print(title3) end
print()

local found_zero = false
local found_neg = false

if format then print(title1) end
print("Items with positive score (more positive = more liked):")
if format then print(title2) end

-- print positive votes in forward order: best items first
for k,v in pairs(item_votes) do
   if v.vote == 0 and not found_zero then
      print()
      if format then print(title3 .. title1) end
      print("Items with zero score:")
      found_zero = true
      if format then print(title2) end
   end

   if v.vote < 0 then break end

   print(v.vote, item_data[v.key])
end

if format then print(title3) end

-- print negative votes in reverse order: worst items first
reverse(item_votes)

for k,v in pairs(item_votes) do
   if v.vote >= 0 then break end

   if v.vote < 0 and not found_neg then
      print()
      if format then print(title1) end
      print("Items with negative score (more negative = more disliked):")
      if format then print(title2) end
      found_neg = true
   end

   print(v.vote, item_data[v.key])
end

if format then print(title3) end

print()
if format then print(title1) end
print("Unordered polish / quality of life improvements:")
if format then print(title2) end

table.sort(qol_improvements)

for k,v in pairs(qol_improvements) do
   print('+', v)
end

if format then print(title3) end
Example result of script on a test dataset:

Code: Select all

-------------------------------- Vote Tally: --------------------------------

Items with positive score:
20      Semi-compelled random encounters. Chance modification from song/spell/etc
18      Escape key should back out of screens
8       Noise / smashing walls should alert nearby enemies
8       Large dynamic spell selection / versatility (not <=5 at once)
2       Remove or alter loot chest animation (it's too exuberant / MMO-ish)
etc...

Items with zero score:
0       Trapped chests, with mitigation means (spells/rogues/etc)
etc...

Items with negative score:
-4      Occasional anti-magic/anti-light zones
Per suggestion in thread below: items moved aside as "quality of life" polish improvements. These can be collected in their own list, rather than diluting the set of things to vote on:
  • Escape key should back out of screens
  • PC positions should reset after combat
  • Remove or alter loot chest animation (it's too exuberant / MMO-ish)
  • Inventory GUI comparison popup between equipped and other item
  • Move GUI combat controls out of middle of character grid
  • Game option to disable repeated taunt audio
  • Improve/clarify Ambushed! indication
  • Minimize console-ization of UI where possible
  • Minimize combat delays (e.g, blocking animations, or delays on Enemy's Turn text)
Edit 1 (2018-Apr-11): Add some new items from thread below, fix minor spelling mistakes.
Edit 2 (2018-Apr-11): Per suggestion, move more polish oriented items to list separate from main vote items.
Edit 3 (2018-Apr-14): Update voting script to not count instruction examples as actual votes.
Edit 4 (2018-Apr-18): Update voting script: print vote stats, and print negative items in order from most to least despised.
Edit 5 (2018-Apr-21): Update voting script: score ties now broken by (up-down) count. Also add --fmt for formatting codes.
Last edited by demeisen on April 21st, 2018, 9:47 am, edited 10 times in total.
demeisen
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by demeisen »

I guess that idea didn't go over very big :lol:.

Well, it can only mean a so much anyway. Not much of the player base reading the forums, and not a representative set for sure.
phimseto
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by phimseto »

Hey demeisen, this is pretty great. I actually just suggested something similar earlier today, as I'm currently working on my own updated report but was hoping the backers could work out amongst themselves what they think is key now that we've had a few weeks of discussion. My plan would be to present both - my take on the data and the backers'.
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Lucius
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by Lucius »

demeisen wrote: April 10th, 2018, 2:14 pm I guess that idea didn't go over very big :lol:.

Well, it can only mean a so much anyway. Not much of the player base reading the forums, and not a representative set for sure.
The idea is fine, the effort involved is not. If only internet forums could allow members to create polls. That would be so much simpler.
demeisen
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by demeisen »

Lucius wrote: April 10th, 2018, 3:58 pm The idea is fine, the effort involved is not. If only internet forums could allow members to create polls. That would be so much simpler.
Well, it would still be necessary to have a process to settle on what should even be on the poll, so that has to happen regardless.

Anyway, I didn't see a way to create a poll on this forum, and external polling sites are often a bit sketchy and some people don't want to let random sites run javascript in their browser. Also, tying it to forum accounts goes a long ways to prevent ballot stuffing. Also^2, this way we control the tally method. Cut and pasting a line of text is a very low bar, so that probably weeds out people who didn't really care about the result much anyway.

I do want to modify my original suggestion:
A tally could be taken periodically.
With a bit more thought, I do not think that's a good idea. I think it should have a fixed end. Otherwise it encourages "strategic voting".
_noblesse_oblige_
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by _noblesse_oblige_ »

demeisen wrote: April 8th, 2018, 7:10 pm I think this should be focused on plausible ideas.
Who is the arbiter of what is considered plausible?
demeisen wrote: April 8th, 2018, 7:10 pm just constructive input.
Who is the arbiter of what is considered constructive input? As far as I'm concerned, "make the game more like the originals" is constructive input.
demeisen wrote: April 8th, 2018, 7:10 pm Also, we'd need a tally process. Initial proposal, which I wrote a small script to do, is to let each person have up to 10 upvotes (fewer is fine), and up to 5 downvotes (fewer is fine). Each person's top vote gets 10 points, next gets 9, and so on down to 1.
Do you have an example of where such a voting system has been successfully employed?
demeisen wrote: April 8th, 2018, 7:10 pm
  • + Allow out of combat spell use
The game already does, as I've posted several times. See the "Mage Flame" section of the "Dragon Breath" spell.
If the request is for separate out-of-combat spells, though, then I support this.
demeisen wrote: April 8th, 2018, 7:10 pm
  • + Restoration of dex/luck stats, with some meaning
Constitution, as well - mentioned previously. As it stands now, it is conflated with the traditional notion of Hit Points.
demeisen wrote: April 8th, 2018, 7:10 pm
  • + Being on fire should have some negative status effect
This probably needs clarification. Enemies can clearly be seen to be on fire and to take fire damage.
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Gizmo
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by Gizmo »

When Bethesda wanted a list of community questions for Todd Howard (about FO3; before it shipped), they asked the forum, and three members agreed to collect non-duplicated questions from a few suggestion threads with 200 posts each. The members culled the posts down to the requested twenty (plus five alternates, in case he couldn't comment on some of them). In some cases they merged what questions they could, in order that they include as many related questions as possible. They emailed them a PDF. Later Todd addressed all twenty five questions in his own answer thread, and was pretty cool about it.
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ZiN
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by ZiN »

Well, we have the list and we've been providing extensive feedback for a year or two, so really, the ball is in InXile's court now. For a change, InXile could show, or tell us something, that proves they have been actually reading and listening, because what I've seen so far pretty much proves the opposite. It's been an one-way communication and the demo also wasn't too promising for an old geezer BT fan.

But alright, don't say I won't play by the rules; Here are my top ten, from the list:

+ Large dynamic spell selection / versatility (not <=5 at once)
+ Long term SP pool (spell AP cost subtracts from, no casting when zero)
+ Allow out of combat spell use
+ Restoration of dex/luck stats, with some meaning
+ Game mode to disable post-combat auto-resurrection. Spell/temple instead
+ Chars which die in combat should receive no exp for that combat
+ Semi-compelled random encounters. Chance modification from song/spell/etc
+ Pitch black dungeons requiring light source (nice fit for UE4 engine)
+ Optional scrolling combat log
+ Remove/alter juvenile animations (e.g. butt wagging)

Of course, I concur with all items on the list, and eagerly await InXile's input on how and when are they going to address them.
Serjo
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by Serjo »

ZiN wrote: April 11th, 2018, 3:47 am+ Chars which die in combat should receive no exp for that combat
That would be pointless if all companions and enemies scale with the main character anyway, as reported by the gaming press.

I support the rest of your top ten, though I don't think any of them will be implemented.
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ZiN
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by ZiN »

Serjo wrote: April 11th, 2018, 4:02 amI support the rest of your top ten, though I don't think any of them will be implemented.
In that case, as I've said, I eagerly await InXile's input, as to why is that so, and how their design is superior and more befitting a Bard's Tale sequel, than our suggestions. We have had highly detailed and reasoned discussions about our suggestions, so, again, the ball is in their court now.

Also here is a bonus one, that wasn't on the list:

+ Fire your UI designers already and make a proper, non-console RPG UI, worthy of Bard's Tale. (How to do that? Discussion over here.)
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Lord of Riva
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by Lord of Riva »

First of all Thank you Demeisen for the work you did, to be honest when i read your thread i did not see what i should add as you already reflect the community opinion (quantity wise).

it would make things vastly easier to make a forum poll is that not Possible @Moderators @Phimseto?

im in a bit of a pickle here as i did not play the old games, however i read the discussions and quite a few things i agree on. I will likely ending up taking points that i think could be improvements but there are probably quite a few i do not really have an opinion on, this should not be counted as a vote against their importants though.

I will point out the ones i think are the most important here:
  • + Large dynamic spell selection / versatility (not <=5 at once)
    + Elimination or style alteration of neon blue combat grid
    + More complete/robust keyboard controls (especially in combat) (and im not harking on oldschool here: hotkeys are still very relevant)
    + Improve/clarify Ambushed! indication
    + Inventory GUI comparison popup between equipped and other item
    + Allow out of combat spell use
    + Remove or alter loot chest animation (it's too exuberant / MMO-ish)
    + PC positions should reset after combat
    + Escape key should back out of screens
    + Death animations shouldn't be blocking (slows down combat pace)
    + Enemies shouldn't delay ~2s on Enemy's Turn overlay text
    + Don't lock voice packs to classes/races
  • - Restoration of dex/luck stats, with some meaning (pointless, as i depends on the systems and just changing the system to include them? nah)
    - Being on fire should have some negative status effect (it deals damage right? so if this is about animation, i can live with some cut corners on enemies here)
The rest i dont have an opinion on, they can work and would not necessary be a bad idea but its nothing i want per se.

EDIT: thanks at the posters above:
  • - - - - - - - - - - - Scaling enemies
Just dont do that, unless you are an idle game. 1. i want to progress 2. i dont want to fight against lvl 90 goblins (unless there is an actual story on why the starting trash is that strong ! )

or to make it clearer: if you can beat a voidborne demon you should not have a problem with a goblin that uses a sharp wooden stick.
PsychicMonk
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by PsychicMonk »

  • no main char: start in the Adventurers' Guild and all player created characters should be equal/interchangeable (decouple xp from all chars if chars have to scale), people who don't want to create characters can use pregenerated characters instead
  • character progression should have a bigger impact than equipment (especially on monks): level 1 char with endgame gear < high level char with starting gear
  • no scaling enemies
  • cosmetic changes already stated
demeisen
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by demeisen »

PsychicMonk wrote: April 11th, 2018, 4:48 am [*] no scaling enemies
Thanks - I added your new items (and a few others that appeared in the thread further above). For auto-scaling, I phrased it in the opposite sense ("Auto-scale enemies"), because I expect this would be widely downvoted as being unpopular. It seems better for likely popular things to be up-voted and likely unpopular ones to be downvoted.

To several posters above: Note that this is NOT a voting thread. However, we can use this to refine the list of things to vote on.
Lord of Riva wrote: April 11th, 2018, 4:16 am it would make things vastly easier to make a forum poll is that not Possible @Moderators @Phimseto?
All the better if there is. I didn't spot one, but who knows, maybe there's some forum feature that can be toggled on.
ZiN wrote: April 11th, 2018, 3:47 am InXile could show, or tell us something, that proves they have been actually reading and listening,
InXile made a post above stating:
phimseto wrote: April 10th, 2018, 2:57 pm ... I'm currently working on my own updated report but was hoping the backers could work out amongst themselves what they think is key now that we've had a few weeks of discussion. My plan would be to present both - my take on the data and the backers'.
Also, we have evidence in multiple other cases that forum input has been adopted. No, not in every case you want, and yes, there is still a big list people want. Hence, I thought it would be a good idea to attempt to collect this data to distill a massive unfocused barrage down into a succinct, ordered list. (My personal list is very similar to yours, BTW, albeit with some minor ordering differences).
demeisen
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by demeisen »

I would like to propose that these two items be collapsed into one:
  • + Death animations shouldn't be blocking (slows down combat pace)
  • + Enemies shouldn't delay ~2s on Enemy's Turn overlay text
They seem to get at the same core issue. If there are no objections, I can replace both in the list with:
  • + Avoid slowing combat pace (blocking animations, delays on Enemy's Turn text, etc).
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Lord of Riva
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by Lord of Riva »

demeisen wrote: April 11th, 2018, 8:34 am I would like to propose that these two items be collapsed into one:
  • + Death animations shouldn't be blocking (slows down combat pace)
  • + Enemies shouldn't delay ~2s on Enemy's Turn overlay text
They seem to get at the same core issue. If there are no objections, I can replace both in the list with:
  • + Avoid slowing combat pace (blocking animations, delays on Enemy's Turn text, etc).
yes, i agree. i would actually cull some of these as they are more akin to actual gameplay issues/lacking mechanics due the alpha state:

+ Improve/clarify Ambushed! indication
+ Game option to disable repeated taunt audio
+ Inventory GUI comparison popup between equipped and other item
+ Remove or alter loot chest animation (it's too exuberant / MMO-ish)
+ PC positions should reset after combat
+ Escape key should back out of screens
+ Enemies shouldn't delay ~2s on Enemy's Turn overlay text
+ Minimize console-ization of UI where possible.

i dont want to say that this is bad feedback (on the contrary) but it feels like lacking polish rather than "changes" to the game
demeisen
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by demeisen »

Lord of Riva wrote: April 11th, 2018, 9:31 am yes, i agree. i would actually cull some of these as they are more akin to actual gameplay issues/lacking mechanics due the alpha state:

i dont want to say that this is bad feedback (on the contrary) but it feels like lacking polish rather than "changes" to the game
Concur. They seem like good items, but are a different level of feedback - as you say, more related to polish. That also means people don't have to chose between a core mechanic such as, say, a RNG damage component, and polish improvements like escape backing out of screens.

Maybe they can be presented as a separate list, sans priority, of "quality of life" improvements.
phimseto
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by phimseto »

demeisen wrote: April 11th, 2018, 9:51 am
Maybe they can be presented as a separate list, sans priority, of "quality of life" improvements.
If you guys did that, I would be sure to pass it along. Categorize as much as you feel you need to.
PsychicMonk
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by PsychicMonk »

demeisen wrote: April 11th, 2018, 8:14 am [...]For auto-scaling, I phrased it in the opposite sense ("Auto-scale enemies"), because I expect this would be widely downvoted as being unpopular. It seems better for likely popular things to be up-voted and likely unpopular ones to be downvoted.
I really hope that this won't backfire. Auto-scaling enemies would break the game for me even if everything else were perfect.
demeisen
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by demeisen »

PsychicMonk wrote: April 11th, 2018, 10:43 am I really hope that this won't backfire.
Good point. There could be confusion about the direction being voted on. OTOH, if it's phrased as "Don't auto-scale enemies", the trigger phrase "auto-scale" could still lead people to downvote it in the negative sense, thus acting in favor of auto-scaling.

I'm not sure how to best handle that. Suggestions?
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thebruce
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Re: Proposal about voting for plausible changes

Post by thebruce »

Just an fyi, I'm working on a rough little simplistic topical voting type interface to help bubble the most prominent topics by individual comments and votes. If it works well, it (select users) can merge common themes into single topics or split them out to distinct ones.
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