Investment Options?

Discussion about the upcoming Wasteland 3!

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Investment Options?

Post by Oldschool Roleplayer » September 30th, 2016, 1:32 pm

As a long-time fan, gamer and professional investor (corporate VC), I'm very excited about the possibility of private investing in the Wasteland 3 project. Of course, I do have some questions:

1) I can't find InXile's 10k or any other financial data, by virtue of InXile being a private company. Is Brian Fargo willing to release that data to us before October 5?

2) I saw that InXile is only accepting up to $2.75M in equity, with a minimum of $1k investment. Is there a maximum investment in the project, or could Min Liang Tan or someone else invest 2.5M the moment the kickstarter opens up, and then investments close within 20 minutes?

3) Based on current experience with 3 kickstarters already, what is the estimated release date and/or payback period of said investment? (I'm planning on getting married and buying a house in 5 years or less, so I'm wondering just how liquid this investment will be).

4) What will be the legal structure of this investment? Will InXile serve as a holding company for a separate Wasteland 3 company, or will the project itself be just another department from within InXile, with a contractual agreement among Kickstarter backers being unofficial "investors?"

I know this is an emotional investment for me, but I still want to make sure I do my homework, first. Thanks in advance for answers!

Barry

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Bubbles » September 30th, 2016, 2:04 pm

Oldschool Roleplayer wrote:1) I can't find InXile's 10k or any other financial data, by virtue of InXile being a private company. Is Brian Fargo willing to release that data to us before October 5?
This is probably a troll question, but it case you are serious: it seems extremely unlikely that inXile would release that information. If you invest in WL3 through Fig, you will receive shares in a shell company operated by Fig. If you want financial details, your best recourse is to contact Fig's service staff.

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Brother None » September 30th, 2016, 2:06 pm

Hey Barry, thanks for the interest! The best source for all this info is two-fold: one, if you have access to the campaign you can click on the "invest" button to be taken to a page with more information, including precise documentation and filings explaining the structure. Two, if you have more questions after this, please contact help@fig.co, they will be more than happy to answer any question you have!
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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Oldschool Roleplayer » September 30th, 2016, 7:08 pm

Brother None wrote:Hey Barry, thanks for the interest! The best source for all this info is two-fold: one, if you have access to the campaign you can click on the "invest" button to be taken to a page with more information, including precise documentation and filings explaining the structure. Two, if you have more questions after this, please contact help@fig.co, they will be more than happy to answer any question you have!
Thanks for the info, Thomas. How do I get access to the campaign? I'm a previous backer of other games, but I haven't put in more than a few hundred dollars between Wasteland and Bard's Tale IV (and I haven't turned on my baker sticker(s) on this forum). Are the investment opportunities by invite-only, from previous larger backers?

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Gillsing » September 30th, 2016, 8:25 pm

I received an email with a link. (Subject: "Get an exclusive early look at inXile's next campaign!‏") If you're a previous backer too I can't see why they wouldn't have sent one to you as well. Unless you unsubscribed to inXile newsletters. Or changed your email address without telling them. Or maybe check your spam folder?

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Zombra » September 30th, 2016, 10:00 pm

Oldschool Roleplayer wrote:As a long-time fan, gamer and professional investor (corporate VC), I'm very excited about the possibility of private investing in the Wasteland 3 project. Of course, I do have some questions ...
Whatever you find out, I'm sure many would appreciate your analysis and opinions broken down into layman's terms! Thanks in advance! :D
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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Oldschool Roleplayer » September 30th, 2016, 10:40 pm

Gillsing wrote:I received an email with a link. (Subject: "Get an exclusive early look at inXile's next campaign!‏") If you're a previous backer too I can't see why they wouldn't have sent one to you as well. Unless you unsubscribed to inXile newsletters. Or changed your email address without telling them. Or maybe check your spam folder?
Interesting. The last relevant email in my inbox is titled "Project Update #31: The Bard's Tale IV by inXile entertainment."

Nothing in the spam folder, either. But something is weird--I don't see Update #30, either. And I never delete any of the project updates. I wonder if it's a problem with Hotmail.

Either way, as long as I can get back on track, I'll be good.

-----
EDIT: I think I might have an idea what's going on. I tried to log in to the backer page from here, and it's not accepting my email address because it uses an underscore. The web site is telling me I need an @ symbol for it to be a valid email address, and it truncates my email after the underscore. I'm wondering/suspecting that might have something to do with why some of my emails are not going through....

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Gillsing » October 1st, 2016, 1:44 am

Project Update #30 was sent July 22 (link), so if it's not there, and you didn't delete it, then yeah, it must've been lost somewhere. All the project updates are sent by the same no-reply@kickstarter.com, which should by now be a 'trusted sender' or whatever it's called. But the mail with the early look at the campaign was from newsletters@inxile.net, so if they're having trouble with your email-adress, that would certainly explain why you got left out.

I wonder if you'll miss out on this too then, which was also mentioned in that very email: "For backing one of our previous projects, when the campaign launches we will also be sending you a special loyalty discount of $5 USD towards any reward selection, no strings attached." :?

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Bubbles » October 1st, 2016, 1:47 am

You should be careful when quoting the alleged contents of that e-mail. You might be in breach of an implicit confidentiality agreement, which might have severe repercussions.

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Darth Trethon » October 1st, 2016, 3:19 am

Educate yourself before investing.....this video starts off talking about Tim Schafer and Double Fine....you can ignore all that....most of the video breaks down to the letter exactly what Fig is and precisely what you're getting yourself into by investing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFX0f_YUn1I

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by SagaDC » October 1st, 2016, 7:09 am

Darth Trethon wrote:Educate yourself before investing.....this video starts off talking about Tim Schafer and Double Fine....you can ignore all that....most of the video breaks down to the letter exactly what Fig is and precisely what you're getting yourself into by investing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFX0f_YUn1I
That video is very outdated, given recent changes in the legal circumstances surrounding Fig.

Game shares can now be sold legally, with the SEC's approval, so the concern about only "reserving" game shares is no longer a valid argument against investing in Fig. Fig is also no longer required to create a separate LLC for every game that is crowdfunded through their service, making the investment process much simpler than it was for the first few campaigns they ran before the full SEC approval.

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Darth Trethon » October 1st, 2016, 7:18 am

SagaDC wrote:
Darth Trethon wrote:Educate yourself before investing.....this video starts off talking about Tim Schafer and Double Fine....you can ignore all that....most of the video breaks down to the letter exactly what Fig is and precisely what you're getting yourself into by investing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFX0f_YUn1I
That video is very outdated, given recent changes in the legal circumstances surrounding Fig.

Game shares can now be sold legally, with the SEC's approval, so the concern about only "reserving" game shares is no longer a valid argument against investing in Fig. Fig is also no longer required to create a separate LLC for every game that is crowdfunded through their service, making the investment process much simpler than it was for the first few campaigns they ran before the full SEC approval.
Even assuming all that is true it still doesn't make the company not operate at a loss....and a company that by their own reports in Dec 2015 may not last until December 2016.....and should Fig go out you still have zero rights....at that point you won't be able to try to sell the shares(which is oddly good, because it would be a scam) and no rights to legal action.

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Gillsing » October 1st, 2016, 7:39 am

Bubbles wrote:You should be careful when quoting the alleged contents of that e-mail. You might be in breach of an implicit confidentiality agreement, which might have severe repercussions.
I was careful. There's nothing in the email about any sort of confidentiality. Newsletters are not implicitly confidential. Someone need to explicitly state otherwise when that is not the case. But feel free to speak further on those 'severe repercussions'. Forewarned is forearmed.

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Re: Investment Options?

Post by Oldschool Roleplayer » October 2nd, 2016, 10:02 am

Darth Trethon wrote:Educate yourself before investing.....this video starts off talking about Tim Schafer and Double Fine....you can ignore all that....most of the video breaks down to the letter exactly what Fig is and precisely what you're getting yourself into by investing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFX0f_YUn1I
Thank you very much, Darth Trethon, for the link you've posted. Learning everything you can before making any sort of investment is critical.

That being said, the analyst in this video sounds like an accountant, who only understands investing in C-corps on the NYSE. Everything he described in his video is pretty typical in venture capital. In VC investing, you are taking a greater risk because you are investing in your faith in the company or project itself. Returns are often greater because of that as well.

The only reason this project must follow SEC regulations is because InXile is making this project available to investors in a pseudo-public entity. The structure of Fig sounds rather ingenious. However, just because it must pass the SEC rigor does not mean we should treat this investment like it were being traded on the NASDAQ. Again, this is still operating like a venture capital deal--or, consider us as angel investors, if you will.

For VC and angel deals to work, Brian Fargo is putting his own reputation on the line here. In VC, founders often start multiple companies throughout their lives, so his reputation counts 100x more than InXile's reputation does. If InXile decided to "take the money and run," Mr. Fargo would never find another investor again for the rest of his life. His name would be relegated to the ranks of Elizabeth Holmes and Bernie Madoff. And Mr. Fargo has an impeccable reputation in the gaming world, which is why there can be absolutely NO DOUBT that he is presenting this opportunity in good faith.

I can't speak to Tim Schaeffer, as I have no idea who he is, but I have known Brian Fargo's name since I was a child. I have fallen in love with just about everything he's ever created. It is BECAUSE of my faith in him, and understanding the nature of this business deal, that I am willing to potentially risk (and all investments are risks) my hard-earned money to help him fund this next project. There is no reason, whatsoever, for him to steal a measly $2.5M and destroy the rest of his entire career.

I can assure you that there is literally zero chance of anything in that YouTube video mentioned happening in the case of Wasteland 3. You have my word as a stranger on the internet, who claims to be a corporate venture capitalist. ;-)

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