Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

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cadriese
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Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by cadriese » February 28th, 2017, 2:19 pm

Thanks for the "Hide crisis objectives" toggle (and eventually coming to your senses in this regard), much appreciated.

Now we just need another one for turning off those pointless reminders what Left Mouse/Right Mouse does, as well as an option for either scaling or completely hiding the over-exaggerated decorative elements under the characters' name tags and the game should finally be in an acceptable state as far as the HUD of the PC version is concerned.

Or do InXile's UI designers still think that this is "good design"?:

Image


The blurry dialogue lines-bug (only the odd-numbered ones?) still persists too, btw:

Image

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by Drool » February 28th, 2017, 10:53 pm

...quit pressing tab?
Alwa nasci korliri das.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by Firkraag » February 28th, 2017, 11:24 pm

Drool wrote:...quit pressing tab?
It's passive-aggressive suggestion, counterproductive to the meaningful discussion and you should quit doing it.
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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by Lord of Riva » March 1st, 2017, 2:42 am

Firkraag wrote:
Drool wrote:...quit pressing tab?
It's passive-aggressive suggestion, counterproductive to the meaningful discussion and you should quit doing it.
i agree.

I really like how its designed generally (eg. it looks good) but at the same time it does not work as intended as its supposed to help you find things.

i guess if worst comes to worst it would be sufficient to have an option to only show important things instead of reworking everything.

Like it is now it does not really serve a purpose (in areas with NPCs)

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by Firkraag » March 1st, 2017, 3:44 am

I can see this. Not highlighting [s]stock[/s] unnamed NPCs, so you could single them out on your own, if you want.

You know, like when you look around and there are always few people, who stand out from others and everyone else who aren't, unless you specifically start to look at them one by one.
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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by cadriese » March 1st, 2017, 6:26 am

Drool wrote:...quit pressing tab?
Sure, but why have a highlighting feature in the first place then when it's completely failing to quickly help you identify or spot individual NPCs in crowded situations?

Like the 4 special NPCs you can rile up to protest against the execution? They're practically invisible and it's actually easier to make them out by hovering the cursor over every NPC in the crowd individually:

Image

Being able to turn off the decorative elements or scale them down significantly would help immensely with readability in situations like this.


Same goes for the pop-ups on the top edge of the screen (below the turn queue during crises) that constantly remind you what the Left Mouse or the Right Mouse Button does.

Image

Image

They may be useful for complete newcomers or people with short memory but they just contribute to make the screen look too busy in HUD-element-heavy situations (like above), they do get annoying really fast and, especially for veterans of the genre or people who like their HUD as minimal as possible, they're completely redundant and only get in the way.

It's 2(!), max. 3 mouse buttons (if you count the mouse wheel). The average gamer surely can remember what Left Mouse and Right Mouse does in the respective context if he/she has done it before a couple of times. Those (very consoley) pop-ups not being optional from the very start is bordering on insulting many people's intelligence, I'd imagine.

You have those different cursors perfectly and unmistakingly communicating what it's going (and what it's not going) to do when you click anyway, so why not make those pop-ups/notifiers toggleable as well for a more tidier, less cluttered HUD?

Image

(from left to right, LMB/RMB where applicable: Talk, Interact, Examine, Loot, Attack/Talk, Attack, Can't Attack, Can't Attack/Talk, Interact/Examine, Ranged Attack, Leave Area, etc)
Last edited by cadriese on March 2nd, 2017, 2:04 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by Jernaugh » March 1st, 2017, 8:04 am

I've yet to see any of the fuller areas, but these screenshots certainly lead me to agree. The decorative flourish is nice, but not functional in this case. Being able to remove or scale it would help. A hybrid system where only "important" NPCs get the flourish would work too, but that might lead to accusations of excessive hand-holding if not implemented with other options.

The mouse pop-ups bother me less, but the cursors certainly imply that they are redundant. Of course, that's nice and easy to process, but it does add to clutter. Making them optional or toggleable (maybe only shown when Tab is held?) would probably be the best solution.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by hasunA » March 6th, 2017, 7:57 am

It also doesn't make sense if you look at the things you can already turn off like the Tutorials, Tide Feedback, Movement Barks, Crisis Objectives or the Selection Circles, Offscreen Indicators and Interactables In Combat.

Why stop there?

For a game that's "Powered by Pillars of Eternity Technology" (= runs on the same engine) it sure dialed the HUD/UI customizability back quite a few notches. You can't even turn off the HUD completely to take a proper screenshot of the environments.

If some of the recent bigger AAA multi-platform releases proved something then it is that there's an audience - especially on PC - that appreciates being able to strip the HUD of as much as possible for a maximum of immersion and having to rely on your own memory and explorative or investigative abilities.
And it doesn't matter if it's a 3D First Person ARPG or a 2D isometric CRPG either.

It's ridiculous and sad how this got through QA in the first place, by the way:
cadriese wrote:Image

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by PBergensen » March 12th, 2017, 8:10 pm

After a few hours in and having seen the Tab highlighting utterly fail in those instances the OP described I too can only implore inXile once more to look into this. Especially crises with many combatants bunched up or just close to one another and the resulting visual chaos when highlighted is the exact opposite of a pleasant experience.

Again, this screams for a HUD scaling slider or an option to get rid of the pretty, but ultimately detrimental embellishment. And while you're at it, more options for turning off other unneeded things too, including the mouse pop-ups.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by natzy » March 14th, 2017, 11:52 pm

cadriese wrote:
Drool wrote:...quit pressing tab?
Sure, but why have a highlighting feature in the first place then when it's completely failing to quickly help you identify or spot individual NPCs in crowded situations?

Like the 4 special NPCs you can rile up to protest against the execution? They're practically invisible and it's actually easier to make them out by hovering the cursor over every NPC in the crowd individually:

Image

Being able to turn off the decorative elements or scale them down significantly would help immensely with readability in situations like this.


Same goes for the pop-ups on the top edge of the screen (below the turn queue during crises) that constantly remind you what the Left Mouse or the Right Mouse Button does.

Image

Image

They may be useful for complete newcomers or people with short memory but they just contribute to make the screen look too busy in HUD-element-heavy situations (like above), they do get annoying really fast and, especially for veterans of the genre or people who like their HUD as minimal as possible, they're completely redundant and only get in the way.

It's 2(!), max. 3 mouse buttons (if you count the mouse wheel). The average gamer surely can remember what Left Mouse and Right Mouse does in the respective context if he/she has done it before a couple of times. Those (very consoley) pop-ups not being optional from the very start is bordering on insulting many people's intelligence, I'd imagine.

You have those different cursors perfectly and unmistakingly communicating what it's going (and what it's not going) to do when you click anyway, so why not make those pop-ups/notifiers toggleable as well for a more tidier, less cluttered HUD?

Image

(from left to right, LMB/RMB where applicable: Talk, Interact, Examine, Loot, Attack/Talk, Attack, Can't Attack, Can't Attack/Talk, Interact/Examine, Ranged Attack, Leave Area, etc)
Thank God you posted this, please can somebody fill me in as to what the hell the last icon suppose to mean? That for leaving an area. Is that some kind of a blow through a hole?
I like all the other cursors but this one I just don't get.

I installed the mod posted in guides section on steam and already most of the problems are gone.
Look out below! Above! Sideways!

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by RadonGOG » March 19th, 2017, 1:11 pm

natzy wrote:
Thank God you posted this, please can somebody fill me in as to what the hell the last icon suppose to mean? That for leaving an area. Is that some kind of a blow through a hole?
I like all the other cursors but this one I just don't get.

I installed the mod posted in guides section on steam and already most of the problems are gone.
I guess it´s simply showing of something piercing a circle as a symbol of entering...

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by natzy » March 19th, 2017, 1:28 pm

RadonGOG wrote:
natzy wrote:
Thank God you posted this, please can somebody fill me in as to what the hell the last icon suppose to mean? That for leaving an area. Is that some kind of a blow through a hole?
I like all the other cursors but this one I just don't get.

I installed the mod posted in guides section on steam and already most of the problems are gone.
I guess it´s simply showing of something piercing a circle as a symbol of entering...
Thank you! But what the hell is that going through the circle? Is it some kind of wind? It's driving me nuts! :)
Look out below! Above! Sideways!

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by Varana » March 19th, 2017, 1:31 pm

Sn'erf could probably shed some light on that.
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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by Hawke64 » March 19th, 2017, 2:31 pm

It also would be convenient to be able to toggle highlight for NPC and interactive objects, instead of keeping <Tab> pressed.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by agris » March 22nd, 2017, 9:58 am

Thanks to Sea, we can remove the NPC name plates and shadows. I also changed over the PC's selection circles to IE-green.

Image

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by cadriese » March 22nd, 2017, 5:56 pm

agris wrote:Thanks to Sea, we can remove the NPC name plates and shadows. I also changed over the PC's selection circles to IE-green.

Image
Looks SO MUCH better already!

If inXile still can't be arsed to take note and do something about this themselves - are you planning to turn this into a full-fledged HUD/UI mod for TTON? I wouldn't mind copying, pasting and swapping out the relevant files manually, if that's what it'd take.

The mouseover-pop-ups for LMB/RMB would be a little more difficult to get rid of, I reckon? Not to mention being able to adjust the font size of the name tags or the size of the icons for the examinables and/or interactables?

Love the little touch with the IE-like selection circles there. I'm playing with all selection circles turned off myself, but I can appreciate little things like this, very nice, very nice indeed.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by sear » March 22nd, 2017, 9:39 pm

cadriese wrote:The mouseover-pop-ups for LMB/RMB would be a little more difficult to get rid of, I reckon? Not to mention being able to adjust the font size of the name tags or the size of the icons for the examinables and/or interactables?
Removing the LMB/RMB prompt might be trickier. Even if you replace the texture files with transparent ones, you would probably see things missing from elsewhere in the UI, since the sprites get reused in multiple places. The entire input helper element has to be hidden, not sure how easy that would be to do from a modder's perspective.

I will also just chime in that the feedback is appreciated and noted. I don't know how much of it we are able to act on at this time, but we have seen the suggestions.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by agris » March 23rd, 2017, 2:04 pm

I went ahead and made smaller interaction, inspection and loot icons. I left the zone transition icons larger because that seemed appropriate.

Image

I wish I could get the PST selection circles for my party, but I don't think Near Infinity has access to the resource that defines them. If it does, please let me know.

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by cadriese » March 29th, 2017, 1:01 am

sear wrote:
March 22nd, 2017, 9:39 pm
I will also just chime in that the feedback is appreciated and noted. I don't know how much of it we are able to act on at this time, but we have seen the suggestions.
Good to hear.

@agris
cadriese wrote:
March 22nd, 2017, 5:56 pm
If inXile still can't be arsed to take note and do something about this themselves - are you planning to turn this into a full-fledged HUD/UI mod for TTON? I wouldn't mind copying, pasting and swapping out the relevant files manually, if that's what it'd take.

The mouseover-pop-ups for LMB/RMB would be a little more difficult to get rid of, I reckon? Not to mention being able to adjust the font size of the name tags or the size of the icons for the examinables and/or interactables?

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Re: Feedback on UI/HUD, Pt. 3 (Release version)

Post by agris » March 29th, 2017, 2:13 pm

I can post step-by-step instructions and provide the art I made, but unless the maker of the unity asset bundle extractor (check the community forum and my [MOD Q] thread) enables command-line control of it, there's no modding framework to make the changes I did anyway but manually. And I'm not going to distribute ~500 MB of mostly inXile's game data. I had to modify a few of the resource.asset files, and at least one of them is 261 MB.

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