Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

For all discussion on all the previous Bard's Tale games: the classic 1980s games (Bard's Tale, II: Destiny Knight, & III: Thief of Fate) & the humorous Bard's Tale (2004) spin off.

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Jesse011
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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by Jesse011 » April 12th, 2019, 4:34 am

Id like to be able to save monsters. Ive always been a fan of collecting the highest hp of certain monster types and im currently running a group with 4 wacum the wiz with kato bracers in 2 to farm items faster and id like to be able to stash them rather than return to ds3 every time i want to bring them out. I know people will try to duplicate items with them, but what difference does that make?

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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by Ahkaran » May 29th, 2019, 7:34 pm

I wish you hadn't screwed with the game programming. Why did you feel the need to mess with any programming code at all? For instance, Disrupt Illusion DIIL didn't cause illusion casting mobs to fizzle spells, what kind of stupid crap is that? It caused your party to disbelieve their summoning which also granted experience. Disbelieve spell makes the party disbelieve illusions already created but you have to cast it repeatedly. And you still took the experience away from it as well. You took that whole aspect out of the game, even in your legacy mode. I'm sure it was a game flaw in its original creation but it was a part of the XP grind. Makes me wonder what else you cut out of the game. I bought this to relive the old experiences and congratulations you already ruined it.

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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by _noblesse_oblige_ » May 30th, 2019, 2:27 pm

Yeah, there are a handful of areas where the remasters, even in Legacy mode, deviate from the originals. In some cases, the originals on different platforms varied in their logic, so there was no definitive source of truth. (And I don't believe that the Apple ][e version was ever consulted.) All in all, though, Krome has made a high fidelity remaster of the original series. And, if you think the Krome remasters have any significant problems, then I would suggest playing the Barrows Deep game from inXile and see how inXile messed with a lot more than game programming... like everything: lore, mechanics, overall feel of the series.

Krome is still actively developing the remasters, btw. I linked them to your post. If you can provide evidence that DIIL worked the way you describe on a particular original platform, I wouldn't be surprised if they at least considered matching that behavior. In my experience, they've been pretty responsive when people point out stuff like this.
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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by Ahkaran » May 31st, 2019, 11:15 am

How can I provide evidence? No platform today can run Bards Tale 2, if it did then that's what I would be playing. If Inxite has a pure unaltered 80s release copy of the game that can run on a current windows platform, then just play the game. Or an old C64 computer. Go to the Maze of Dread with a 4 monks up front, couple Sorcerers with DIIL, find a group of mobs with at least 3 Dream Mages, usually at 90', kill everything except them. Be sure to have one sorcerer cast DIIL first round. Once everything else is dead, just defend everyone for 20 or 30 rounds, then kill the mages, you will see exactly what I mean.

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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by Drool » May 31st, 2019, 1:21 pm

Ahkaran wrote:
May 31st, 2019, 11:15 am
How can I provide evidence? No platform today can run Bards Tale 2
https://www.dosbox.com/
http://www.ccs64.com/

I've used both to check how things worked in the originals.

Also, I can't speak for 2, but in 3, you didn't get XP for disbelieving illusions.
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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by Ahkaran » June 1st, 2019, 7:46 am

Hey Drool in those links above what should I download that will make original BT2 play?

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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by Drool » June 2nd, 2019, 11:33 am

Depends on which version you have. If you have the DOS version, use DOSBox. If you have the C64 version, use CCS64. There's emulators for just about every old system ever invented, so if you have a different version, getting an emulator shouldn't be terribly difficult.

Or, if you have the re-release that inXile released however many years ago, that's just the DOS versions with a built-in DOSBox wrapper, so it'd give you the original DOS experience.
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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by rakenan » June 4th, 2019, 11:27 am

I'd really like more granular control of legacy options. It seems like a lot of random stuff is lumped into a few blanket categories - notably the experience option. I disagree with some but not all of the changes lumped in there, I'd like to be able to select which arbitrary balance changes I want to revert (I'd specifically like to put everything as it was when the remaster of BT1 was released).
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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by thebruce » June 7th, 2019, 3:30 pm

Ahkaran wrote:
June 1st, 2019, 7:46 am
Hey Drool in those links above what should I download that will make original BT2 play?
More info and instructions here. Hopefully that helps
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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by Drool » June 7th, 2019, 4:17 pm

rakenan wrote:
June 4th, 2019, 11:27 am
I'd really like more granular control of legacy options.
Honestly, I leaned more towards a binary switch; all or nothing.

The risk, as always, is options spam (gold standard on this is Oil Barons* with its 100+ options screen, where they displayed one at a time to select through; no, seriously). Granularity is fine and all, but there's a fine line between granularity and "too damn many options" and it's always a balancing act to find a balance between the two. Honestly, I think they did a reasonable job.


* "It is considered to be one of the rarest of all Epyx games." Well, shit. Now I wish I still had my original boxed copy of this thing.
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Re: Features you wish The Bards Tale Trilogy had

Post by rakenan » June 11th, 2019, 3:03 pm

Drool wrote:
June 7th, 2019, 4:17 pm
rakenan wrote:
June 4th, 2019, 11:27 am
I'd really like more granular control of legacy options.
Honestly, I leaned more towards a binary switch; all or nothing.

The risk, as always, is options spam (gold standard on this is Oil Barons* with its 100+ options screen, where they displayed one at a time to select through; no, seriously). Granularity is fine and all, but there's a fine line between granularity and "too damn many options" and it's always a balancing act to find a balance between the two. Honestly, I think they did a reasonable job.


* "It is considered to be one of the rarest of all Epyx games." Well, shit. Now I wish I still had my original boxed copy of this thing.
It is not (or should not be) particularly tough to have a standard "Legacy mode is on" checkbox with an "Advanced Legacy options" menu to open the more granular controls. The user experience would be fine, as it is with other games that use a similar system.

The hard part would be testing the options for buggy interactions - and that's why I don't expect to get what I want.

No big deal. I got enough to justify the $50 I spent backing BT4 even though I consider BT4 to be a waste of electrons. I do wish I could have just told them to give all that money to Krome, though.
This year, I resolve to work harder. . . because it's obvious the world is not going to end itself.

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