Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

For all Bard's Tale IV discussion that does not fit elsewhere, suggestions, feedback, etc. No spoilers allowed.

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cparker94
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Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by cparker94 » December 3rd, 2016, 9:52 am

Would someone please wake me up when there is relevant, new Bard's Tale news? Seems like all anyone cares about is Wasteland. Is Brian Fargo even part of this project? And what's up with the BT Remasters? Please keep the backers engaged. Lack of information is very disheartening as I feel my pledge is supporting other ventures.

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marceror
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by marceror » December 3rd, 2016, 12:01 pm

Posted on 11/21:
sear wrote:Bard's Tale IV is still very much in development. :) We're working on some pretty big stuff to share with the community right now, but right now a lot of the team is in heads-down mode.

As for other titles impacting Bard's Tale, Wasteland 3 is largely being developed in Newport Beach (the same team that is now beginning to roll off of Torment), while Bard's Tale IV is being worked on in NOLA.
Regarding the remaster, it seems that inXile signed a poorly drafted contract that stipulated that the developer would be paid upon completion, but apparently had no date by which she was required to deliver. So I guess she's not motivated to prioritize this project because she's "not sure when she'll get paid" (when she completes it, duh), and so she just works on it in her "spare time". Maybe one day it will be delivered, if the stars align properly. This is why writing good and detailed contracts is very important.

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Dork Mage » December 3rd, 2016, 6:38 pm

marceror wrote: So I guess she's not motivated to prioritize this project because she's "not sure when she'll get paid" (when she completes it, duh), and so she just works on it in her "spare time".
In some fairness, what does "complete" mean? No bugs? :lol:

But yeh, it's likely that both parties failed to specify what constitutes "done."

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by marceror » December 3rd, 2016, 10:08 pm

One would hope that the contract stipulates what is meant by complete, but based on what I can piece together we're talking about a poorly crafted agreement, so it wouldn't be surprising if it doesn't actually do that.

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Zombra » December 3rd, 2016, 11:53 pm

cparker94 wrote:Seems like all anyone cares about is Wasteland.
You'll notice it's the forum people talking about Wasteland ... not inXile really. inXile doesn't control what we talk about. During and immediately after the BT4 kickstarter there was plenty of buzz about it.
cparker94 wrote:Please keep the backers engaged. Lack of information is very disheartening as I feel my pledge is supporting other ventures.
I wish they communicated more too, but there's no reason to think your pledge went to something else. BT4 has had an official update approx. every two months since the campaign. Wasteland 3 has had zero official updates since the campaign.
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by ThePompousPeasant » December 12th, 2016, 2:45 pm

Just found out about the game but it seems to be a ways off to release yes? 2018 perhaps?

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Zombra » December 12th, 2016, 2:55 pm

ThePompousPeasant wrote:Just found out about the game but it seems to be a ways off to release yes? 2018 perhaps?
Sounds about right.
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by satoru » December 13th, 2016, 10:46 pm

ThePompousPeasant wrote:Just found out about the game but it seems to be a ways off to release yes? 2018 perhaps?
For complex PC game KS I always take the predicted release date with a grain of salt. It'll come when it's ready and that's fine. In it for the long haul

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by amigacooke » December 16th, 2016, 7:23 am

Perhaps a nice Christmas present is in preparation for us?

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Drool » December 16th, 2016, 8:16 pm

Hopefully we'll get something soon now that ToN is in its final push to release. Although, being a completely different studio, you'd think they could manage regardless.

Hey inXile! You need someone to do press releases for the NOLA studio? I'd be willing to work remotely!
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by CrowleyDK » January 23rd, 2017, 4:55 am

Please come with some news, i'm beginning to regret my kickstarter support, it seems like you used my money on other games.

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Zombra » January 23rd, 2017, 11:12 am

CrowleyDK wrote:Please come with some news, i'm beginning to regret my kickstarter support, it seems like you used my money on other games.
Don't feel that way, BT4 is in full production, they just don't post a lot of updates.
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Lix » January 31st, 2017, 5:58 pm

Small update from an interview in Games™ (print version):
Speaking of The Bard’s Tale IV, how is development progressing? InXile seems to have been keeping it close to the chest.

Fargo: We’ve held back showing what we are doing with the combat system and I’m really happy with it – both from a visual style and a completely unique way to approach it. There’s a core group of people that would be very happy if it were exactly the same as the first one – attack, attack, attack, defend, defend, defend, and then you sat back and watched to see what happened. But we don’t think that exact play works in today’s marketplace; we play modern games, it's not like we’ve been in a cryochamber since the Nineties and woke up and said, “What are we going to do?”

We sit around playing Skyrim, Hearthstone, Witcher and all of these other projects, and we want to be right there with them, but in our own unique way. But we also know that party-based combat is important, that turn or phase-based combat is important; so we take all the elements and we say those things from Bard’s Tale, those we have to do, but I wonder if we can put them in another form that moves along faster, that is visually more interesting, and that’s what we’ve done. It is very unique, we’re going to show it [soon]. When people see and understand it, when they see how much depth there is to the combat and how much thought is going to be involved, I think they are really going to appreciate it.

Is the combat the element of the game that you are the most proud of then?

Fargo: Yeah, I would say so. Like I said, it is very clever. If my brain is not engaged by the systems then I’m checked out. If I end up having to do the same thing every single time, in every instance of combat, then I’m going to be checked out. I think that’s why people love Dark Souls, because you’re constantly changing your tactics to deal with stuff. Well, we are the same way. You’ll need to come at [encounters] in a different way each time because you are going to get slaughtered if you take a typical approach. When you begin to feel and think that way, I begin to feel like it is mission accomplished because now you are using your own unique strategy and your brain to combat – no pun intended – these situations.

How would you compare The Bard’s Tale IV to Wasteland 2 and what’s coming with Torment? Are they going to be of a similar size and scope?

Fargo: From a purely gameplay hours perspective? It is less ambitious, because with these games – with dungeon crawls – it doesn’t have the same reading component and the same slow motion component of those products. It’s still a solid role-playing game, hour wise, but it just isn’t going to be half what those games are. It is, however, visually more ambitious than those two, because of the nature of where the camera is at, I think, and we will see what other people have to say. But I think it is right up there with some of the triple-A visuals you see out there.
So BT4 will be less than half as long as Torment? Interesting.

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Drool » January 31st, 2017, 9:20 pm

When people see and understand it, when they see how much depth there is to the combat and how much thought is going to be involved, I think they are really going to appreciate it.
Sigh. I don't want or need a massive amount of depth in each combat. It's a dungeon crawler, guys. The challenge is the collective combats, not individual ones (save boss fights, naturally).
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by ZZGO » January 31st, 2017, 10:31 pm

Drool wrote:
When people see and understand it, when they see how much depth there is to the combat and how much thought is going to be involved, I think they are really going to appreciate it.
Sigh. I don't want or need a massive amount of depth in each combat. It's a dungeon crawler, guys. The challenge is the collective combats, not individual ones (save boss fights, naturally).
Dunno. By the end of BT3 it was getting both trite and pointless, with most people just skipping random combat altogether through Sir Robin's Tune. Just look at the Geomancer (or higher level Archmage) spells - they really jumped the shark, getting within inches of a Win Battle (WIBA) spell. (NUKE ftw!) Heck, even the Dreamspell in BT2 was ridiculously over the top already.
Personally, I'm all for a quality over quantity approach in a new combat system.

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by thebruce » February 1st, 2017, 6:39 am

Drool wrote:
When people see and understand it, when they see how much depth there is to the combat and how much thought is going to be involved, I think they are really going to appreciate it.
Sigh. I don't want or need a massive amount of depth in each combat. It's a dungeon crawler, guys. The challenge is the collective combats, not individual ones (save boss fights, naturally).
I was just going to say the same. Yep we live in a modern era of gamin, but you can't just forgoe the "sequel" aspect (not that they are entirely) - that said, I look forward to whatever else they are bringing forward from the originals, but if the core concepts of combat that made BT classic unique are lost, then despite how fun the combat may be, it just won't be Bard's Tale IV. BT combat was never centered around significant thought/strategy for battle outside, as you say, 'boss' fight equivalents.

Want lots of quick epic fights, not long slow and far between. Combat was never cinematic. We understand that the characters and creatures were much more epic and superpowered than mere text and animated cards could imply, so that didn't need to be depicted for us. If there will be epic sweeping camera intros and actions and movements and angles and all that - I want the option to turn it off. Even if it is all pretty and gorgeous to look at it. It's just not Bard's Tale. :lol:
ZZGO wrote:Just look at the Geomancer (or higher level Archmage) spells - they really jumped the shark, getting within inches of a Win Battle (WIBA) spell. (NUKE ftw!) Heck, even the Dreamspell in BT2 was ridiculously over the top already.
Personally, I'm all for a quality over quantity approach in a new combat system.
Right, and I point to my previous paragraph. The ridiculously fantastical and epic nature of the battles didn't have to be depicted. We naturally understood it to be so, so the combat phase didn't have to reflect that. We saw the stats, knew what our guys could do, and with brief and quick strategies rolled up, did our stuff, and failed or passed for reward. That rapid style combat sort of led the gameplay environment.

Likewise, if combat in BT4 takes more time and effort, it's going to alter the gameplay feel.

Again, in and of itself, that won't necessarily be a bad thing if they get it right - but it's won't feel like Bard's Tale.
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by ZiN » February 1st, 2017, 6:51 am

ZZGO wrote:Just look at the Geomancer (or higher level Archmage) spells - they really jumped the shark, getting within inches of a Win Battle (WIBA) spell. (NUKE ftw!) Heck, even the Dreamspell in BT2 was ridiculously over the top already.
Those awesome spells were quite fun once you got to use them. They also had a steep cost, so you had to be picky about which fights were worthy of nuking, lest you run out of magic points. BT2 featured major anti-magic zones as well (the Grey Crypt for example), and on top of that BT3 deployed a healthy amount of magic resistant/immune monsters, such as magic-eaters and vortexes. All in all, while the spells were indeed super-powerful, you couldn't just mindlessly spam them. Nerfing them will take a lot away from the classic BT feel for me. Same goes for crits as well (including hunters, rogues, slayers, stoneblades, etc).
Sir Robin's Tune (and Speedboots) on the other hand, indeed needs to be changed (not the tune itself ;)), constantly running from everything with a 100% chance is not so much fun.

Also, please fuck Skyrim, Hearthstone and The Witcher and if you really need something to draw inspiration from (other than BT), look at Wizardry (8) and, to a lesser extent Might&Magic (X).

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Drool » February 1st, 2017, 11:17 pm

ZiN wrote:Sir Robin's Tune (and Speedboots) on the other hand, indeed needs to be changed (not the tune itself ;)), constantly running from everything with a 100% chance is not so much fun.
I dunno. Malefia was pretty brutal. What with the antimagic and silence zones, it still wasn't assured. And, well, when you're fighting 20 foes that can instantly kill you and 20 foes that can age you and 20 foes that can turn you to stone, those massive spells were pretty necessary. Also, by the time you were neck deep in Malefia, NUKE was almost a waste. DIVA was far more powerful, as were spells that pushed foes back.

Of course, the fight against Tarjan was only difficult if you forgot about PERC, which wasn't a crazy Archmage or Geomancer spell.
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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by ZZGO » February 2nd, 2017, 5:19 am

ZiN wrote:Those awesome spells were quite fun once you got to use them.
Yes they were, for a short time. I give them that.

But I very much preferred the nail-biting low-level combat in the first few dungeons of Skara Brae. The combat system worked best there, where you had real choices to make (like, do I graduate my Conjurer and Magician into two Sorcerors, two Wizards, or one of each?) and where all character classes still mattered and made a difference. Where non-Spellcaster classes were still worth having, had a purpose and worked as an asset. Later on, they're just the padding for two or three Archmages, and combat tactics have been replaced by spell point economics.

What I'm saying is that the BT combat system came apart in high-level mega-combat. The scope of the battles escalated to a point where it simply didn't adequately work anymore. It simply wasn't worth keeping for a sequel thirty years down the line. Therefore I for one am happy to hear inXile are reworking the combat system. I want Bard's Tale IV to be an evolved version of its roots, not a retro game. YMMV, of course.

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Re: Any new Bard's Tale IV news???

Post by Drool » February 2nd, 2017, 10:51 pm

The big concern I (and I assume others) have is the cumulative result of those changes. If every combat is a 5-10 minute tactical slog, then what about the game as a whole? Will it have drastically reduced combats (thus making it far less of a dungeon crawler) or will it still have dungeon crawler-numbers of combats making the entire thing be a soul-crushing chore?

I would rather they kept it a dungeon crawler. If they want to innovate, then use a new property. Why use the Bard's Tale property if you're going to toss the setting, the mechanics, the classes, the races, the combat, and the style of game? The already did that, in 2004.
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