[ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

For discussing Torment's story as it slowly gets unveiled, as well as discussing the game's setting. Ninth World discussions encouraged. Spoilers allowed.

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Aramintai
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[ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Aramintai » March 2nd, 2017, 5:50 pm

I've finished the game and man it sucks so bad in many ways.

First things that disappointed me - CUT STRETCH GOALS:
-Voluminous Codex.
-Numenera crafting.
-Additional Major City: Oasis of M'ra Jolios.
Remember that video where you actually go there? Now it's just a stub, one small area fathom in your mind.
-The Order of Flagellants and Austerities and the Jagged Dream. Jagged Dream at least was mentioned in the game. And no, you cannot join many different factions as you did in PS:T, only one is joinable with a single benefit of free sleeping, that's it.
-The Toy companion and another unnamed one.
-New Area: The Ruins of Ossiphagan. Remember that pretty promo art? What's left of it is just a Mere (black and white text adventure).
-Live Orchestra. I'm not sure I've heard a single piece of live orchestra in the entire game, whole music felt very muted and tame and badly placed in the game as tracks occasionally overlapped.

NOT CUT BUT LAUGHINGLY SHORT:
-Crystal Dimension. It's nothing like this pretty art here.
-Expansive Epilogue. I don't think you can call a bunch of slides, most of which about npcs you met in the game, count as expansive.
-Number of Legacies. There is always one single ending slide about the protagonist and what counts for legacy is a small blurb at the end of it, painted in very general strokes of your dominant Tides.
-Castoff's Labyrinth and Hall of Lingering Reflections. Whatever it was supposed to be it all ended up stuffed in the Calm and Calm itself is not that big. And again, it doesn't even remotely look like this.

Now this rather large list may have been dismissed by me if it weren't for other glaring problems in the game:
BAD GRAPHICS:
-Bad lighting and shadows. Without them characters felt like plastic dolls, disjointed from the map they were running on, especially in dark places like the Bloom.
-Bad animations. Even PS:T's sprites had better and more various animations than these clunky ones in T:TON. Also that awkward running and "docking" animation to npcs and interactive objects was very painful to watch.
-Bad portraits. Why on Earth someone decided to change more or less tolerable portraits in the beta into those hideous ones in release version? Why characters' portraits in the game look nothing like in promotional art, this one, for example? Why people have to make threads on how to rummage through game files to put custom portraits on these characters? Also, half-bald protagonist is a very questionable choice.
-Bad character models. I know, I know, this is not the latest Unity version, but come on, today is not 1999 and they just look plain bad and low poly.

BAD PATH-FINDING:
Characters frequently getting stuck on other characters or objects is never fun.

BALANCE PROBLEMS:
Game is obviously rigged in favor of nanos. Since most of the game, even crises can be resolved non-violently nanos clearly have the advantage as most of the conversation bonuses are in that class and majority of non-violent checks are intellect based.

BAD VOICE OVER:
Not only for some companions, but for the protagonist especially. I've played as a male Last Castoff and his gruff, mature voice didn't fit his very youthful portrait at all. Also, I don't get why Last Castoff was voiced at all since he\she is supposed to be a blank slate.
Furthermore, much of the VO we've heard from npcs and companions in the beta and videos is gone.

VERY BAD COMBAT:
It's clunky, it's boring, it's sluggishly slow. Can't skip enemies turns, can't make it faster. Many combat abilities didn't feel powerful, even high tier ones. I'd take fast RTwP combat of PS:T any day over this cheap mess.

LOTS OF JUNK NUMENERA:
Most of the oddities, except the ones you can use, you can safely sell, they're just junk.

Now let's talk about narrative problems:
TOO BLANK SLATE-Y PROTAGONIST:
He\she is just the ultimate blank slate who stays that way throughout the game. Unlike the Nameless One from PS:T who was unique in both looks, situation and ability, the Last Castoff has none of these things. Plain looks, one of many just like him/her who can't die. And throughout the game you are treated as just another one of "those" guys. It wasn't really inspiring to play as such character.

SHALLOW COMPANIONS:
Their dialogue was sparse. Their problems lied on the surface. Endings of their personal quests could be guessed right from the start. Their reactivity like love\hate of the Last Castoff was laughable, especially in modern days of rpgs. None of them instilled any sense of attachment or emotion from me like PS:T companions did. Some of these companions seemed worse written and had fewer lines than others. The only one I can recommend taking is Erritis, at least he's entertaining and useful in combat.
Also, what really pissed me off is that in Numenera setting there is a myriad of different races and species and yet somehow every single one of the companions is plain human. PS:T had a tiefling, a talking skull, a succubus, a gith'zerai, a burning corpse, an automaton and a walking armor as companions, where on Earth something of this variety is in T:TON?!

SEVERE LACK OF NON-QUEST GIVER NPCS YOU CAN TALK TO:
In P:ST you could have conversations with harlots, random people on the street, dabuses and all sorts of denizens of the planes. Sometimes it was just a short dialogue with no benefit, sometimes they gave you some lore knowledge, sometimes stirred your memory. In T:TON non-quest givers are simple ambiance with a hovering text blurb.

HEAVY DEPENDENCE ON TEXT TO CUT COSTS ON VISUAL ELEMENTS:
Sometimes too much text is, well, too much. Sometimes an npc portrait, a well executed animation, pre-rendered or ingame cutscene can convey a much better image than dozens upon dozens of words. Wall of text after a wall of text without resting for the eyes doesn't seem like a good design for an rpg. I've played this game, seen those walls of text and numerous Meres (text adventures) and frequently thought to myself - would it have been better if devs just did a visual novel?
And sometimes, it's not the amount of words that counts, but their quality.

MERES ARE USELESS?
In the game it is revealed that the Last Castoff can change reality by changing things in the meres (text adventures), however, differently played out choices didn't seem to matter in the real world. Sure, npcs start getting confused about their memories of events being mixed up, but not a single person you get killed in the Meres is actually dead. I had that serious wtf moment in Memovira fight, where 3 people I got killed in the meres were there, still alive and acting like nothing happened.
The only thing meres seem to be good for is learning some secret you can later use in dialogue options.

DISAPPOINTING ENDING AND VILLAIN:
If you were waiting for some grand revelation on the nature of the Tides and the Sorrow prepare to be disappointed in the end.
The Sorrow is not connected to the Changing God's immortality like the Transcendent One was in PS:T. It's simply a guardian of the Tides, which are never coherently explained in the game. It and the Tides existed long before the Changing God learned how to somehow abuse them to make and change his bodies (this also is never coherently explained). Abusing the Tides is bad for people's mental health around the world apparently, so the Sorrow's aim is to eradicate the abuser and his castoffs. But! If you play nice and pretty promise not to abuse the Tides, the Sorrow seems pretty lenient to the Changing God and his castoffs. No hard choices here.
The Changing God's original goal is also not some grand mystery, you can start surmising what it is even in Sagus Cliffs. It's all about his long dead sick daughter. But that goal was largely forgotten as time passed and more pressing matters occurred.
The First Castoff had one good twist in the game, being a Memovira, but in the end she wasn't anyone special, a wasted potential.

The ending locations were a disappointing bunch of short stubs called fathoms, some of which clearly were at some point part of something larger that was cut. For example, Kholn village or M'Ra Jolios.
And the end itself is very anticlimactic with a bunch of easy choices culminating in a little ingame cutscene and a bunch of boring ending slides, only one of which is for the protagonist. What does one life matter? A single crappy ending slide, that's what. So much for the Legacy, sigh.

I think it would have been better and more true to PS:T if the Sorrow was actually an aspect of the Changing God's daughter, who was also a subject of numerous resurrection experiments. At least that quest in Sagus Cliffs about possessed women would have nicely alluded to that.
Or it was born when the Changing God first switched bodies, or was an aspect of the First Castoff after she was killed.
But I guess I'm not a writer and boring choices are better?


I'm getting to my verdict soon, but first here's a perhaps incomplete list of similarities to PS:T I've compiled:
PS:T = T:TON:
The Nameless One = The Changing God and all his castoffs
Shadows = Castoffs
The Transcendent One = The Sorrow
Sigil = Bloom
Portals = Maws
Deionarra = Miika (The Changing God's daughter)
Blood War = Endless War
O = O
Dustmen = Memorialists
Torment = ??? (I never could get on who's torment T:TON's title is based on, as it wasn't really a game about some great Torment as in PS:T, probably just a slap on to capitalize on the glory of the original game)

Imho, all of these are better in PS:T, narratively speaking. Perhaps, it's in no small part because of the well established and well written AD&D Planescape setting - it melded more beautifully with the story than Numenera and T:TON ever could.

MY VERDICT AND LESSONS LEARNED FROM THIS CAMPAIGN:
I give this game 7/10 and that whole 7 is for all the hard work the writers did to pull this otherwise crappy game out of the swamp of cheap mediocre indie games to a solid ground. I just think this would have been better if they simply wrote a visual novel instead of this half baked rpg and hired a bunch of good artists to paint nice backgrounds.

And as for lessons learned from this Kickstarter campaign (and not only this):
1. Never back a "from scratch" game that has no gameplay to show.
2. Never fall for nostalgia feeling devs are trying to pull to get more money for their crappy projects.
3. Never believe that a game of BG or PS:T quality can be made with less than 5 million dollars from backers money only. Unless devs double that with their own cash, quality, length and stretch goals will surely suffer.
5. What you see in the beta is what you'll get in release version plus\minus some UI changes, tweaks and bug fixes. Don't expect any magical leaps in quality for graphics, animations or any other major feature.

EDIT: I don't know why this isn't getting more attention but an interview recently came out that explains quite a lot how the original promising premise of the Kickstarter campaign we all got hooked on went down the drain because of apparent lack of funding. The original, much more ambitious and interesting plot, main characters and numerous promised locations got rewritten, changed and/or removed completely. That's why the plot at times feels so nonsensical and lacking, heavily promoted characters are diminished into minor roles (the First Castoff, the Changing God) and some areas clearly look like stubs of something greater that was cut.
The interview is here: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017- ... f-numenera
I can only have one comment about this for the devs and Brian Fargo specifically:
You've had it right in the beginning, but your piss poor management and lack of true passion for this project, which could have been the true successor to PS:T, ruined everything. You could have gotten yourself other investment opportunities aside from Kickstarter, like many other indie developers do nowadays, because clearly from the beginning even you could have seen that the funding from backers will not be enough to realize your writers' ambitions. You could have taken more risks and granted this project more of your attention and passion to make this a true labor of love, because that's what PS:T was back in the days when you were young and daring. But now you're old and not prone to take any any risks it seems, making cheap forgettable indie games that capitalize on the great titles of old to make some profit is all you can do now.
Last edited by Aramintai on March 21st, 2017, 5:44 am, edited 14 times in total.
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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by sparkee666 » March 2nd, 2017, 6:42 pm

really negative review, but It is a good criticism.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Sceptenar » March 2nd, 2017, 7:00 pm

Agree with pretty much everything you're saying here. A PS:T this is not.

I particularly found the Changing God to be an uninteresting character when you learned more about him, which disappointed me. There was so much potential there.

And the Sorrow never felt like a real threat. It's more like lightning, you know it's real and once in a blue moon someone gets hit by it, but you never really think to much about it. I'd imagined it being some terrifying force dogging your heels, but nothing...

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Shoitaan » March 2nd, 2017, 9:29 pm

I think your tone is excessively negative and less than a handful of your complaints are unjustified (junk numenera = vendor trash which is quite relevant in RPGs even if they're not particularly thematic). That being said, I think tone aside, most of your complaints are entirely valid which is a damn shame. I don't think the game is a 7. It's an 8 easily but it's definitely not more than that. The writers and a lot of the visuals definitely sold me on the Numenera world as well so I'd be very keen for more games in the universe. It's a damn shame this game wasn't everything we hoped for. Even if we ignore the cuts, its alarming how unpolished the game will feel at times (just looking at the map and the text names of things are half spilling out of the screen and unreadable? Why wasn't that taken care off in alpha??).

The pessimist in me thinks that a management decision was made to divert studio assets to the wasteland franchise because that would sell more units and that's probably true. Shame. Could have had a real classic on our hands. I'm still enjoying the journey though even if the game wont' haunt me for nearly 2 decades like PST did.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by GasMaskFan » March 2nd, 2017, 11:39 pm

Hmm, I disagree and agree about different things here.

I never actually liked Planescape Torment gameplay wise much so never managed to complete it <_< I mean, its story based game where you still have to kill rats and zombies to get exp to progress. I much more like Tides of Numenera's gameplay better since mandatory combat(note that I started out first playthrough as jack and second one as glaive, haven't had trouble with succeeding checks either way even though lack of specific skills means I have to attempt different stuff) doesn't really exist and even the few unavoidable crises aren't just about killing the enemy. That said, you are right about there not really being much Torment in this game. I'd also add that despite Tides supposed to be major part of the story, they don't feel like they come up very often even though I can see why they are supposed to be important.

Game is great adaption of the P&P game if you ask me, including how oddities work(even though oddities are mainly interesting sellable stuff, they ni game include actually useful stuff along with them which does fit the p&p since even though oddities are supposed to be useless, some of them still can be useful), it keeps cyphers which feel like what they would feel like in the p&p and point system is adapted well even though they aren't the health anymore.

Graphics wise I don't really care even though I agree the character models aren't good(the non human ones... I can barely notice difference from humans), but then again I wouldn't mind new game with old crpg's graphics either.

Companion wise I disagree because Rhin is the best companion xP But yeah, there is some reactivity to them but largely I don't think they much care about your decisions? Or rather its hard to tell if you aren't playing as uber jerk

Epilogue I think was actually quite extensive in that it covered a lot of minor quests(btw liked it that it was combined with credits), though I do agree that legacy theme didn't come across that well since its just one blurb.

Cut content I don't miss much, but I am disappointed that tier 4 is max instead of tier 6. Its just feels underwhelming since in p&p at tier six you really feel like you are at max power you can reach while at tier 4 you still feel like you could learn more. So wouldn't mind expansion that adds cut content and adds two final tiers.

That said, I do agree that this is no far perfect game and story wise it could be tighter, but I like gameplay and find story interesting enough for this to be among my top ten rpgs along with fallouts(another game I like spite that I just save scum all the turn based battles because I didn't create character that is able to fight). But yeah, you are right that Sorrow could have had much more presence in the story outside of three scenes(at least through nightmares or something) and that First Castoff ended up being bit underwhelming besides the good twist. On Changing God I disagree since I think he works as selfish immortal jerk he is. Overall, worst thing about the story is that the theme of Legacy doesn't come across that well even though its few time alluded so the theme is really weak. I still like the characters, story and setting and find them all interesting, but if the game had stronger theme I could say without guilt that its great story. Currently I'd say its interesting story and I find that enough for me
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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Serrin » March 3rd, 2017, 11:42 am

A very good summary of pretty much everthing that has gone wrong with this game.
Let's hope Inexile learns something here, because the next crowd funding will not be easy with a legacy like this.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by kaiman » March 3rd, 2017, 12:49 pm

Aramintai wrote:I've finished the game and man it sucks so bad in many ways.
Not wanting to go into much details, but I am wondering if you'd have the same overall opinion if this were a regular release, a game that dropped from the sky one day, without any of us knowing about originally planned features and changes made during development?
Aramintai wrote:BAD VOICE OVER:
Not only for some companions, but for the protagonist especially. I've played as a male Last Castoff and his gruff, mature voice didn't fit his very youthful portrait at all. Also, I don't get why Last Castoff was voiced at all since he\she is supposed to be a blank slate.
I can look over many of the issues that you are listing, as I don't think they are distracting much from the actual game, and are not uncommon for games of this type in general. But I fully agree on the voice overs. It's good they are rare, because honestly I do not like any of them. I know that this has a lot to do with personal taste, but in my book the voices do not fit the characters. At all! You may laugh at me, but I selected my party based on the least annoying voicing. But even that does not hinder me from enjoying the many *good* parts of the game :-)

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Lord of Riva » March 3rd, 2017, 1:25 pm

kaiman wrote:
Aramintai wrote:I've finished the game and man it sucks so bad in many ways.
Not wanting to go into much details, but I am wondering if you'd have the same overall opinion if this were a regular release, a game that dropped from the sky one day, without any of us knowing about originally planned features and changes made during development?
IF the ending is as abrupt as he suggest i would imagine that its the case. For some reason (and i can even relate) endings like this are incredibly horrible

i remember Kotor 2 i was never so disappointed before and wished they had skipped Malachor 5 completely.

Or to make a long story short, if the end is short and unsatisfying they should have made cuts for exactly this in my opinion. Here even more since the legacy and tides was practically the theme of the game.

sadly i wont be able to finish it today.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by kaiman » March 3rd, 2017, 3:10 pm

Lord of Riva wrote:sadly i wont be able to finish it today.
Luckily, I won't be able to finish it for quite a while :-).

As for endings, I never really liked that of PS:T. It took me so long to finish, and I was somehow expecting something more rewarding. But then I thought about all that came before the end, and it was totally worth the ride. I feel it's the same with TToN. Not the end is important, but the path that takes you there.

Besides, from what little I read about the end without looking at any spoilers, it seems that in showing what happened to all kinds of NPCs, isn't that spelling out how your actions affected the world? Your legacy. Wondering if this could have been done in a better way, but to me it sounds adequate, at least.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Aramintai » March 3rd, 2017, 4:09 pm

kaiman wrote:
Aramintai wrote:I've finished the game and man it sucks so bad in many ways.
Not wanting to go into much details, but I am wondering if you'd have the same overall opinion if this were a regular release, a game that dropped from the sky one day, without any of us knowing about originally planned features and changes made during development?
I wrote about that right after I listed all cut and shortened content:
Now this rather large list may have been dismissed by me if it weren't for other glaring problems in the game
And with that huge list of problems I'd down vote any game that would come out, successor to the classic original game or not.
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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Kulin » March 3rd, 2017, 6:26 pm

While i agree with some of your points, I also agree with kaiman. Reads a bit like the typical "overhyped yourself"-story where you get so enormous expectations that it's impossible for anything to meet them.

I actually liked the game and see many things about combat and story(i think its pretty well explained why those particular chars are alive again at the Memovira fight, but i agree that this is a obvious tool abused by the designers to minimize the possible consequences) different.

The worst things for me are:
- It's sad that so many zones have been cut from the game. Those 3-4 different areas(depending on what you count as area) are packed with story, but a little more variety would have been better.

- But the biggest thing for me right now is the extremely obvious bullshit they told us about the cut companions. The companions in the game have such a short and shallow story that i just don't buy this "we cut 3 companions to invest the time in improving the other ones" story anymore. How could the cut companions be any more shallow and boring then the companions in the game? For example: does Rhin have any story at all beside "i've been sucked out of my hometown and want to go back"? And it feels like this with any companion.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by monocle » March 3rd, 2017, 11:39 pm

the OP voiced my thoughts exactly.
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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Elana » March 4th, 2017, 7:59 pm

Kulin wrote: For example: does Rhin have any story at all beside "i've been sucked out of my hometown and want to go back"? And it feels like this with any companion.
Yes, she's some girl that is capable of creating gods or some such, she was tricked by her god, and her personality is dependent on your conduct throughout the game. She's the worst example for your point because she along with Erritis are the most interesting companions in the game. And in my opinion are one of the more interesting companions that I've had encountered. Actually, it's even more of a shame because all of the companions were interesting but their story arcs are so shallow and unfulfilling.

A part of me wants to see what happens to Rhin in the future. And I actually kind of want a sequel to Tides, but I want InXile to stop using nostalgia, and let the game stand on its merits. It has potential and I actually want to see more shenanigans that I can get in as the Last Castoff. I want to explore more of the 9th world. But you can't really explore the 9th world in this game.

You're only immersed in Sagus and the Bloom. And just barely.

I enjoyed the Tides system, which is the only morality/reputation system that I've ever liked.

Tides of Numenera can be much more and I think that InXile is capable of making a fantastic sequel to it. But as it stands the original is only good. Or adequate. And for Backers it's a major disappointment because it fails to ultimately succeed(or even attempt at) what it was aiming to do.

I'm sorry you guys are disappointed. I know what it's like having been burned by this crap in the past before. It sucks, and it removes any potential for enjoyment in the game.

I hope that Mr Brian Fargo and Co. try again, but that may ultimately depend on sales unfortunately, I hope it does well enough to have a second go at it, and I'm even more hopeful that it will be successful.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by DaveTheArakin » March 5th, 2017, 1:34 am

Kulin wrote:For example: does Rhin have any story at all beside "i've been sucked out of my hometown and want to go back"? And it feels like this with any companion.
I really have to disagree with you on that. Rhin was the best companion and the one who have the most interesting story arc and character development. If anything, she was the companion I was most attached to in my party and it was a really emotional and satisfying to see her leave and then come back as a fully grown badass.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Abyssal Winter » March 5th, 2017, 1:23 pm

Wow- I finished the game today, and most of what you say is spot on with my issues with the game.

Glad to see I'm not the only one who was disappointed.

Still a bit sad, though.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Fyre » March 6th, 2017, 8:04 am

Very good review. The devs should be grateful for this acute prognosis of what went wrong, and they should seek to fix what there is that is possible to fix, and own up to the errs that cannot be remedied.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by sorinmask » March 6th, 2017, 1:43 pm

This review is SO lenient. There are so many more wrong things with this game - this only scratches the surface.



Hey Brian... how does it feel to blow it? Good, right? You're laughing your way to the bank right now, I bet, right?



Well here's the thing: you'll probably never going to have a shot at using the "Torment" name again. Why?



... because you took a dump on it. Either that or you don't understand it. Both equally as bad. And yes, I mean just you Brian Fargo. The rest of the team tried, especially the writers.














Oh. And stop throwing Colin under the bus. Putting the writer to take the blame of the director for stuff not being in the game, and not being transparent is something so bloody juvenile and cynical I can't come up with words for it.










I'd tell you to wake up, but it's too late. Guess the real love is them post apocalyptic stuff... fingers crossed for Wasteland 3, right?



PS: Here's something obvious for you, Brian:

In Planescape: Torment you always have the option to kill everyone you see. Maybe less so in Sygil, but did you know you can kill about 10 demons in Sygil (including the one in the Smoldering Corpse Bar) which nets a bunch of fun and exp?

Did you know that Brian? Did you know you have that choice? Do you remember ***FUN*** Brian?

I bet you do. You know all about choices. That's why this game is full of them: to be purchased on PC *AND* consoles.

Fun is laughing your way to the bank now; but in the future, I'll probably keep my money. ^__^

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by otokage » March 8th, 2017, 1:07 pm

Hey this is exactly how I feel! I also have given a 7/10 to this game in other places like Metacritic. Great review.

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Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by Dweller » March 8th, 2017, 10:57 pm

I agree with almost everything the 1st post states.
But the finals disappointment waited for me in the end.
Despite the all the questionable things in the plot I really got into the problem. I decided that one life matters, and expected an option to bring down the Changing Gods designs leaving castoffs alive (maybe stripped of power/immortality, whatever). The whole game the story told me that ambition and egoism blinded castoffs and their creator and it caused the Endless Battle which brought suffering upon the world. THIS is what the plot was all about. But in the ending we are suddenly informed that THE VERY EXISTENCE of castoffs is abusing tides. This concept doesn't really get along with the general idea of the game, but whatver, there is an option to 'let everything be as it was' which feels extremely retarded as you could have as welled spitted on the entire quest and drink ale in Fifth Eye to same result.
Screw that, I liked the character concept of Matkina, and she felt like a single kindred spirit in the whole world. I would still be fine if player character and this only friendly soul could find some peace together (at least in friendship if developers decided romance is not fitting the concept) after this whole mess. I had her disposition maxed, but the outcomes after which she would not hate you made you/her vanish. The only exception I found was this 'leaving everything as it is' but somehow none of your followers remember you or try to stick with you after the end. Even if you sacrifice all for Matkina, she will give u kiss before you seize to exist, but after that she won't even remember your name, thus the developers laugh at you saying one life does not matter.
PS: even chosing the greater good and removing all the castoffs from existence reveals that the world without castoffs is often worse than it was with them.
Summary: the game has shitton of mechanical problems, but after all it's all about the story. The story is not an unforgettible masterpiece and has various flaws, but it is still intriguing and entertaining. Unfortunately, unless you are absolutely selfish/selfless you will hardly find a satisfying conclusion to your plot.
My only desire in replaying this game is my hunger for vengeance onto this disappointing setting - I want to make a brutish barbarian and smash every damned machine and mortal and castoff (and any part of this world) with my big hammer, ignore all the dialogues and merecasters, spit onto the Changing God in the end, piss unto the First Castoff and bring max destruction upon this sorry realm.

eNTi
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Joined: April 21st, 2012, 1:27 am

Re: [ENDING SPOILERS] This game is disappointing beyond belief

Post by eNTi » March 10th, 2017, 6:42 am

Can someone actually explain the endings to me? Not one of them makes any metaphysical sense? What IS The Sorrow? Is it really the sadness a father felt for the loss of his child? Was The Sorrow a concept or was it something real in that world? I hate it when people use common words to describe something so vague that it might be a concept or it might be a poorly chosen name for an actual being (or place). It's hella confusing for no gain.

In the end I had so many choices it felt as if nothing i did the whole game had any impact. I could just walz through the game and at the end pick my preferred choice? I still don't get what half of the game's stories have to do with anything.

I'm so confused by the last hour of the game... there's no real closure in any of this.

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