Planescape's connection with Numenara

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Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by herm00r » July 6th, 2015, 1:38 am

So I know a bit about the forgotten realms. I've played most all of the the forgotten realms rpg's- baldur's gate 1 and 2, Icewind Dale, Plansecape:Torment. I used to play a bit of D and D too, but I still don't know a ton of the lore. So, sorry if this is a dumb question, but I couldn't find the answer in the plot explanation for Numenara. How are Plansecape and Numenara connected in terms of the video games' stories? I know they mentioned that Numenara will feature a man that can never die, similar to TNO, but that's the only connection I saw (other than they are obviously in the same universe). I was just curious if anybody knows if this is going to be a continuation of the story in the first game or an entirely different story. Thanks!

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by vv221 » July 6th, 2015, 8:00 am

There is no connection between Numenéra and Planescape (the settings, not the video-games). Numenéra is a new pen&paper universe written by Monte Cook. They share something in the realm of weird universes and the insane amount of possibilities they give, but Numenéra is a time on our Earth, one billion years in the future.
The link between "Torment" games will be a matter of design choices and thematics, not something about the universe.

-----

Here you go for an introduction on the setting:
http://www.numenera.com/what-is-numener ... s-setting/

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by VioletShadow » July 10th, 2015, 3:15 pm

Only thematic similarities, no direct connection.
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by Genghistwelve » December 20th, 2015, 12:46 pm

If you are familiar with Wasteland and Fallout, then imagine that the connection is essentially the same. If you are familiar with Black Bioware Isle Obsidian Interplay games, then imagine that the connection is in how the games play in terms of the Son of Bhaal vs. Revan vs. The Nameless One. You encounter recurring common themes and events such as amnesiac heroes, gopher quests (even to the point of that becoming an in-game gag with Portalbenderwinden or whatever his name was).

This is not a directly connected prequel or sequel: it is Apocalypse Now to Conrad's Heart of Darkness.

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by cyseal » January 8th, 2016, 2:43 pm

Does Numenera have Lovecraftian and grotesque elements as Torment does ?

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by Firkraag » January 8th, 2016, 7:22 pm

Planescape had any of the Lovecraftian elements?
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by cyseal » January 8th, 2016, 10:19 pm

Firkraag wrote:Planescape had any of the Lovecraftian elements?
Elements are:
Celestial beings, cults that believes that everybody is a god, demons, some locations, elements connected with nightmares and horror, monsters like glabrezu or http://lparchive.org/Planescape-Torment ... -23-90.png

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by dorkboy » January 8th, 2016, 11:02 pm

@cyseal
Well, the Bloom sounds like it might be vaguely in the direction of what you're asking for. Maybe. And then there's the whole business with the Changing God hopping from one body to the next, and discarding the used "shells".
Edit: My understanding is that there's nothing really supernatural/magical, though, but more of a Star Trek kind of weird (crystal entities, super high tech gizmos, that sort of thing..).

(Or were you asking if the "vanilla" Numenera setting has the same "Lovecraftian" elements that the Torment: Tides of Numenera sub-setting does?)
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by cyseal » January 8th, 2016, 11:16 pm

No, not the same. In it's own style.

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by dorkboy » January 8th, 2016, 11:27 pm

cyseal wrote:No, not the same. In it's own style.
Right.. :?
I have no idea what you mean by that. :lol:
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by cyseal » January 8th, 2016, 11:46 pm

I think we're lost in translation here :lol:
I meant about Lovecraftian elements but not exactly copied from Planescape Torment, ofcourse.
Bloom could have some of it.

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by Firkraag » January 9th, 2016, 12:05 am

While I definitely wouldn't say, that Planescape is vanilla fantasy setting, none of it really Lovecraftian, per se...

...

I wanted to say, that original D&D has everything you mentioned, while it looks more or less generic, but then I remembered, that a lot of it came from Forgotten Realms and D&D 3. Originally, D&D and AD&D was inspired by things, like Conan and H. P. Lovecraft, it's just I and lot of people around me didn't know about him at the time, while D&D already managed to establish it's own unique style and imagery... I started with Icewind Dale 2 and Neverwinter Nights and actually Planescape: Torment was my last game in that bunch. I already knew something about D&D cosmology, it's creatures and metaphysics, so I didn't think about it as Lovecraftian-inspired. I still don't, it's just so mixed up at this point...

My biggest, no, not complaint, but internal opposition against idea of labeling Planescape: Torment as "lovecraftian", that it's not related to genre of cosmic horror in any way... Sigil, we witness looks more like fantasy steampunk in everything, but actual steam engines: there's dirt, there's ruin, there's fog, a lot of thugs, prostitutes, beggars, vermin and otherwise shady people... Hive's aesthetic dominanes my memories of this game (while there are gorgeous places and moments in a game). For the most part the story is very grounded and gritty. You contantly stumble on ugly and potentially repulsive things, that is desribed in details, but at the same time, you're drowned in that world's logic, you don't care if these guys are zombies - they have souls probably and so forth.

If anything, it's anti-lovecraftian setting. The world of PS:T is impossibly gigantic and incomprehensible in it's entirety, but every thing you stumble upon fits, it works - you're not going to fell into despair induced madness, because you embrace this world. Cosmic entities and forces doesn't care about you? So what? You don't care about them back. Unless you chose to. If you read any of the official Planescape setting books, you know, that Sigil's natives doesn't care about cosmic entities either. Or their interest is very pragmatic. Because, beliefs in this world can, in fact, change the Universe. Powers die or being killed all the time, faiths are being forgotten and maps are rewritten... As it brilliantly shown by Namess One, that he's a hero of his own story and that's it. Beaing the game affects no other, than you and your band of misfits. It's not like you can't save the world in PS:T - it doesn't need saving from anyone.

___________________________________________
Concering your question, there are small (not very good, though) supplement for Monte Cook's Numenera, that says "Yes, Numenera has a lot of potential to include Lovecraftian Horror, Mythos and monsters, and if you want so - feel free." That's all this supplement is good for (it's like three pages or something).

But, by your given definition of Lovecraftian it seems, that Torment: Tides of Numenera will be "lovecraftian" enough. You have Changing God, who fights death for aeons, Angel of Enthropy (they renamed him, can't remember how), who sees immortal as abominable, weird cults, weird locations (Bloom, I'm not sure would we also have Gullet?), weird creatures, boundaries between science and magic blurred... Hell, it even says, that it's themes are legacy, mystery and abandonment. Mystery and abandonment are some of the cornerstones of Lovecraftian Mythos, if you ask me.
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by cyseal » January 9th, 2016, 12:06 pm

Firkraag wrote: But, by your given definition of Lovecraftian it seems, that Torment: Tides of Numenera will be "lovecraftian" enough. You have Changing God, who fights death for aeons, Angel of Enthropy (they renamed him, can't remember how), who sees immortal as abominable, weird cults, weird locations (Bloom, I'm not sure would we also have Gullet?), weird creatures, boundaries between science and magic blurred... Hell, it even says, that it's themes are legacy, mystery and abandonment. Mystery and abandonment are some of the cornerstones of Lovecraftian Mythos, if you ask me.

I do feel it too. "Lovecraftian" doesn't need to be connected with the theme but also with the strange and tense athmosphere in environments.

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by Drool » January 9th, 2016, 1:09 pm

I dunno... Lovecraftian has a very distinct feel, as it's really become a sub-genre of its own. TToN could very well have Weird Fiction themes, but I haven't really gotten much of a Lovecraftian vibe from anything I've seen so far.
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by cyseal » January 14th, 2016, 7:12 am

This adds small Lovecraft's vibe to it.
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by Drool » January 15th, 2016, 1:06 pm

Looks more Umber Hulk than anything.
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by CottonWolf » January 24th, 2016, 5:04 am

You can definitely run Lovecraftian games in Numenera. I wouldn't want to bring in the actual Mythos creatures, but incomprehensible hyperadvanced beings with no care for humanity from beyond the stars/deep inside the Earth/other dimensions are absolutely part of the setting. One of the main through-lines for the Into the Dark campaign sourcebook (the space one) is a evil AI that appears unkillable, and exists across the galaxy. That kind of thing is ripe for a cosmic horror game.

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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by GasMaskFan » January 24th, 2016, 11:58 pm

Lovecraftian themes in numenera you ask? :D

http://www.montecookgames.com/store/pro ... -numenera/

Besides that, lovecraftian themes fit numenera really well. Because while setting is sometimes just weird, sometimes its really horrifyingly weird.
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by Firkraag » January 25th, 2016, 2:23 am

GasMaskFan wrote:Lovecraftian themes in numenera you ask? :D

http://www.montecookgames.com/store/pro ... -numenera/

Besides that, lovecraftian themes fit numenera really well. Because while setting is sometimes just weird, sometimes its really horrifyingly weird.
It's not worth it's money.
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Re: Planescape's connection with Numenara

Post by GasMaskFan » January 25th, 2016, 2:34 am

Firkraag wrote:
GasMaskFan wrote:Lovecraftian themes in numenera you ask? :D

http://www.montecookgames.com/store/pro ... -numenera/

Besides that, lovecraftian themes fit numenera really well. Because while setting is sometimes just weird, sometimes its really horrifyingly weird.
It's not worth it's money.
You do realize that I posted that because I found question of whether Numenera has lovecraftian themes hilarious? : D

Also, it is 3 dollars. What did you expect? Something more than few tips and bestiary entries? Pfft, that'd be ridiculous for that price

I guess I should have post this picture instead with that reaction to my amusement .-.

Image

Like, not sure if that counts exactly lovecraftian(it kinda reminds me of Silent Hill for some reason), but it certainly looks horrifying :'D
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