Romanfiend wrote: Woolfe wrote:
This game is really pretty terrible. The writing is the main problem with combat mechanics being a close second. And no, games do not bounce back after they get negatively reviewed on steam. Console gamers are not going to save this title - that is a crazy fever dream - porting was a whole lot of wasted money.
As far as the writing I would describe it as sophomoric and shallow. Way too much exposition with little substance or philosophy. Weak character development.
For the record - I love me some good writing. I have a degree in 18th century poetry and lit, read constantly, loved the original, blah blah blah.
Weren't you "Done"?
Woolfe, Am I upsetting you? Do you need me to be (done)?
Not at all. I just find it somewhat amusing that people who are "Done" with things so often hang around. I mean look at yourself, so "done" that you are posting in threads all over the place.
I have been waiting a long time and invested significant money and trust with the expectation of something that didn't happen. I have a right to be upset and to communicate that frustration with the people that were entrusted to do a good job. I thought that Brian Fargo of all people understood the legacy he was working with here - and I was clearly mistaken on that score.
Sure, but look at it from my point of view, some dude pops up, starts going off and immediately makes a few key mistakes, doesn't even get the company name right, makes a big broad statement of "I AM DONE" then keeps popping back up in half a dozen threads. What does that sound like to you?
Look, I apologise for targeting you in particular. I personally have a few issues with InXile myself. I haven't backed WL3 as a result. I just find it so disingenuous when people make broad statements about leaving and then they hang around.
I want to invite you to consider what your own motivations for being puerile and dismissive might be? Thus far you have contributed nothing - provided no counterarguments - and I get that. You are likely highly invested in the idea of this being a success and maybe past the point that you can evaluate it fairly and objectively. Even so it's not my job to change your mind - if this does it for you - good for you. Ignore me. Clearly we had different expectations.
As I said above, my motivations where that I thought you were more troll than honest detractor.
Mayhap I was wrong, *shrug* it happens.
I haven't contributed any counterarguments, because I don't have a position yet. I wait for a while before I play. I like a couple of patches to come out first. Until I play the game I can't comment on those elements.
I actually don't care that much about Torment, I was a lot more invested in WL2. For me the only thing I have seen them do wrong thus far was the piss poor comms about the cuts. The cuts themselves, I expected overreach, they hadn't even finished WL2 when they started the Torment KS. If you look at the changes in each KS you can see where they have "learned" different things.
Although considering that this game is more a Novella than an actual game - it might be interesting to submit it to people who's job it is to review books and literature. I wonder what they would think of the writing. See most writing flaws are not subjective - provided you know how to evaluate things. For example some storytellers are bad writers (very common) and some great writers are poor storytellers (less common). The problem here is that TToN is both bad storytelling and bad writing - and it's supposed to be an RPG!
Sure, in fact that was my argument. But Technical style and storytelling does not subjective taste equal. Telling people to "shutup" simply because they like the writing is a little rich isn't it? I have friends who liked 50 shades of Grey(shudder) but I don't tell them to shutup because of it. I just point out the flaws in both the story and the technical style.
And because I am the kind of person who likes to find the foundation of a problem, I am left wondering how this happened. Chris Avellone was involved, Brian Fargo was involved, they had resources...so what happened here?
Sure, but if that's the case, you aren't really "done" are you.
TToN is failing - it has failed. It is going to fail so badly that there won't be another Torment nor will anyone likely try this again. How did this happen?
I actually question that. Remembering that the game was funded to get it created, any sales are essentially profit (it won't be as cut and dry as that, but close to), so it won't take much to "break even" so to speak. This is a game that can afford a slow boil, ultimately InXile will take their lumps if they deserve them, get back up and try again, its the nice thing about crowdfunding. If you fuck up, all it will effect is your next funding attempt.
From what I have seen across WL2 and now Torment, even at their worst, it was usually a misunderstanding or a cockup more so than anything malicious. They have repeatedly offered people who weren't satisfied refunds etc throughout the funding period.
Again tho, let me apologise for targeting you in particular. My gripe is more at those who have seemingly decided that InXile are the "devil" because of lack of comms, or cut goals, or because they are "making a game for consoles" and not being PC elitist, etc etc.