Sales numbers and chart watching thread

For all Torment discussion that does not fit elsewhere. No spoilers allowed.

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Romanfiend
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Romanfiend » March 8th, 2017, 5:47 pm

felipepepe wrote:
Romanfiend wrote:TToN is failing - it has failed. It is going to fail so badly that there won't be another Torment nor will anyone likely try this again.
I doubt it. Numenera was already a Torment in name alone - it was never about the setting or characters, having AAA production values or necessarily having Chris Avellone, so nothing's stopping an indie studio or anyone else from making another Torment sucessor.

I look at something like No Truce with the Furies and see something that might hit a lot closer to the original Planecape: Torment than Numenera - as in thoughtful writing and interesting moral dilemas, instead of just "Wow, we have a wacky setting! So random, LOL! Read all about it!"

Hmm, actually that looks really promising! Thanks! I might check out the Novel as well.

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Woolfe
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Woolfe » March 8th, 2017, 7:56 pm

Romanfiend wrote:
Woolfe wrote:
Romanfiend wrote: This game is really pretty terrible. The writing is the main problem with combat mechanics being a close second. And no, games do not bounce back after they get negatively reviewed on steam. Console gamers are not going to save this title - that is a crazy fever dream - porting was a whole lot of wasted money.

As far as the writing I would describe it as sophomoric and shallow. Way too much exposition with little substance or philosophy. Weak character development.

For the record - I love me some good writing. I have a degree in 18th century poetry and lit, read constantly, loved the original, blah blah blah.
Weren't you "Done"?
Woolfe, Am I upsetting you? Do you need me to be (done)?
Not at all. I just find it somewhat amusing that people who are "Done" with things so often hang around. I mean look at yourself, so "done" that you are posting in threads all over the place.
I have been waiting a long time and invested significant money and trust with the expectation of something that didn't happen. I have a right to be upset and to communicate that frustration with the people that were entrusted to do a good job. I thought that Brian Fargo of all people understood the legacy he was working with here - and I was clearly mistaken on that score.
Sure, but look at it from my point of view, some dude pops up, starts going off and immediately makes a few key mistakes, doesn't even get the company name right, makes a big broad statement of "I AM DONE" then keeps popping back up in half a dozen threads. What does that sound like to you?

Look, I apologise for targeting you in particular. I personally have a few issues with InXile myself. I haven't backed WL3 as a result. I just find it so disingenuous when people make broad statements about leaving and then they hang around.
I want to invite you to consider what your own motivations for being puerile and dismissive might be? Thus far you have contributed nothing - provided no counterarguments - and I get that. You are likely highly invested in the idea of this being a success and maybe past the point that you can evaluate it fairly and objectively. Even so it's not my job to change your mind - if this does it for you - good for you. Ignore me. Clearly we had different expectations.
As I said above, my motivations where that I thought you were more troll than honest detractor. :D Mayhap I was wrong, *shrug* it happens.
I haven't contributed any counterarguments, because I don't have a position yet. I wait for a while before I play. I like a couple of patches to come out first. Until I play the game I can't comment on those elements.
I actually don't care that much about Torment, I was a lot more invested in WL2. For me the only thing I have seen them do wrong thus far was the piss poor comms about the cuts. The cuts themselves, I expected overreach, they hadn't even finished WL2 when they started the Torment KS. If you look at the changes in each KS you can see where they have "learned" different things.
Although considering that this game is more a Novella than an actual game - it might be interesting to submit it to people who's job it is to review books and literature. I wonder what they would think of the writing. See most writing flaws are not subjective - provided you know how to evaluate things. For example some storytellers are bad writers (very common) and some great writers are poor storytellers (less common). The problem here is that TToN is both bad storytelling and bad writing - and it's supposed to be an RPG!
Sure, in fact that was my argument. But Technical style and storytelling does not subjective taste equal. Telling people to "shutup" simply because they like the writing is a little rich isn't it? I have friends who liked 50 shades of Grey(shudder) but I don't tell them to shutup because of it. I just point out the flaws in both the story and the technical style.
And because I am the kind of person who likes to find the foundation of a problem, I am left wondering how this happened. Chris Avellone was involved, Brian Fargo was involved, they had resources...so what happened here?
Sure, but if that's the case, you aren't really "done" are you. :D
TToN is failing - it has failed. It is going to fail so badly that there won't be another Torment nor will anyone likely try this again. How did this happen?
I actually question that. Remembering that the game was funded to get it created, any sales are essentially profit (it won't be as cut and dry as that, but close to), so it won't take much to "break even" so to speak. This is a game that can afford a slow boil, ultimately InXile will take their lumps if they deserve them, get back up and try again, its the nice thing about crowdfunding. If you fuck up, all it will effect is your next funding attempt.

From what I have seen across WL2 and now Torment, even at their worst, it was usually a misunderstanding or a cockup more so than anything malicious. They have repeatedly offered people who weren't satisfied refunds etc throughout the funding period.

Again tho, let me apologise for targeting you in particular. My gripe is more at those who have seemingly decided that InXile are the "devil" because of lack of comms, or cut goals, or because they are "making a game for consoles" and not being PC elitist, etc etc.
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by kaiman » March 9th, 2017, 12:54 am

felipepepe wrote:No Truce with the Furies
Never heard of that one before, but it's on my list now :-). Thanks!

To be honest, the number of worthwhile books - and now a game like the above - I've learned about since backing TToN alone was worth the money I spent. Although I guess haunting these forums could also have been had for free ...

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JoniOdin
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by JoniOdin » March 9th, 2017, 12:00 pm

waltc wrote:
JoniOdin wrote:
Jean-Luc wrote:I'm a backer but I'm not playing it at release because I want to wait for patches/dlc/enhanced edition before diving in. It's just a sad fact that most games are simply not complete at release and it usually take a year before they're truly finished.
Yes, same here.
Also, I'm waiting until I get my physical copy I pledged for. Feels more right this way.
It's not "more right"....it is "exactly the same right" because the files are identical, and the game cares not whether you install it from disk or download it.
Oh really? :roll:
That's why I said "feels", not "is".

Lix
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Lix » March 10th, 2017, 2:48 am

Torment has slipped out of the top 100 on Steam today, falling behind Tales of Berseria, Tabletop Simulator, Weapon Shop Fantasy, and Golf With Your Friends. At these ranks the daily sales volume is negligible.

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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Firkraag » March 10th, 2017, 6:44 am

kaiman wrote:
felipepepe wrote:No Truce with the Furies
Never heard of that one before, but it's on my list now :-). Thanks!
Same!
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Nexus
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Nexus » March 10th, 2017, 12:11 pm

Am I reading this wrong, or did it just sell about 50k copies on steam in a week. Not bad? (100k+ "owners", there was about 45k backers?)
So not including gog/consoles. Steamspy http://steamspy.com/app/272270:
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Serjo » March 10th, 2017, 12:23 pm

Nexus wrote:Am I reading this wrong, or did it just sell about 50k copies on steam in a week. Not bad? (100k+ "owners", there was about 45k backers?)
Torment had more than 80,000 backers, and some of them received multiple keys.

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Nexus
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Nexus » March 10th, 2017, 12:46 pm

Ah, my bad your right, my mistake.

IHaveHugeNick
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by IHaveHugeNick » March 10th, 2017, 3:37 pm

50k is probably right actually. A lot of backers redeemed on GOG or switched into a console key.
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Serjo » March 10th, 2017, 4:13 pm

IHaveHugeNick wrote:50k is probably right actually. A lot of backers redeemed on GOG or switched into a console key.
When inXile talked about the failed attempt to offer console keys to backers, they said that "hundreds of people" had signed up for a console key. The amount of backers who never redeemed their EA key or release key on Steam but paid $60 for a separate console copy must be fairly small.

And anybody who played Steam EA but switched to a GOG key for release is already included in the Steamspy numbers.

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Nexus
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Nexus » March 10th, 2017, 5:04 pm

Meh, by my counting, kickstarter lists 74,405 backers, fuckit, a duck and buckit, double it from paypal with slacker backers to 148,810. There gonna do ok.

I still got Pillars of eternity to muscle through to play this, I think they'll do OK. :P

EDIT: It Always a niche of a niche audience anyways, why anyone would expect massive sales is beyond me....

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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by det_expat76 » March 11th, 2017, 9:30 am

I wonder how many backers cannot play / haven't even downloaded a key? I am one of those, my PC is weak and wouldn't be able to play it anyway. I was hoping for a low cost backer console deal, but alas... My Wasteland 2 key is gathering dust in my inxile account too. That said, I am glad that the game was made and is getting good reviews. Guess I paid my PST experience forward, by backing the KS.

I wonder what additional sales volume makes TToN a worthwhile effort for the creators and Inxile? 50K at $50 a piece? 100K? 200K? That'd be $2.5M, $5M and $10M additional revenue respectively. When is it "worth it", i.e. the ~$4M in KS backing and 4 years of development?

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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by IHaveHugeNick » March 11th, 2017, 10:21 am

I'm guessing they have to move at least 100k Remember Valve takes a cut of sales, then there's taxes and so on.
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Lix
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Lix » March 13th, 2017, 10:15 am

First full week of sales in the UK, and Torment is still not in the top 40. Not a sleeper hit.

https://www.chart-track.co.uk/index.jsp ... &ct=110015

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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by D-D » March 14th, 2017, 6:11 am

Image

Really sad :cry:

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Matches_Malone
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Matches_Malone » March 14th, 2017, 9:20 am

I've been reading news and reactions since the game hit the market, and I must say I wasn't expecting these poor numbers. I thought the game wouldn't be very succesful... but not like this.

There have been many things that went wrong during the release, but in my opinion three key factors condemened Torment:

-The -so many times discussed- lack of communication from InXile. Many people is frustrated and angry, and this was reflected in reviews and social media. Many of the criticism is childish, overexaggerated, but there are also many people who brings valid points to their naggings.
-The terrible translations. This is perplexing, since the game's strong point is text. For people unable to read english... well. The spanish translation, at least is atrocious. Even comical.
-Bad timing, terrible marketing. That Steam didn't featured the game the release day was perplexing, too. For a game that tries to imitate a PC classic as Planescape, this lack of attention to PC release was weird. Also, there were so many strong titles releasing those days that the game went almost silent in the videogame social circles.

All of this is very disappointing because Torment represented an opportunitty to bring more narrative-focused crpgs. I hope the situation changes in the future, but it seems unlikely :(

Geese Howard
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Geese Howard » March 14th, 2017, 10:07 am

While I said before that we'll never get close to Pillars 1 and Divinity OS numbers again in a CRPG (besides D:OS 2. That game is obviously going to sell well) in the first month, I don't see how the current number of copies are bad. Look at the steamspy numbers; most games can barely pass the 100,000+ copies sold threshold unless your an AAA game or some early access survival game. Even a popular JRPG like Tales of Besteria is sitting around 75,000 copies sold, and that came out on 1 month before Torment nor isn't it sold on gog. I personally think the number of copies sold is fine for now and it will sell well overtime.

Dork Mage
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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Dork Mage » March 14th, 2017, 1:08 pm

While InXile would certainly like a large number of buyers, backers never really expected that which is why the game was backed on Kickstarter to begin with. InXile would do well to leave the price where it is and wait till after the 'Oom patch' to adjust pricing.

Translation was a mistake from the start. It is difficult to see how a million+ word game could be translated given that context is quite often not comprehensible for an average conversational translator. If each encounter is written like a film script - maybe. But as a novel, good luck. But then, InXile should have known this from WL2 which in comparison was a "simple" translation.

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Re: Sales numbers and chart watching thread

Post by Woolfe » March 14th, 2017, 4:17 pm

Dork Mage wrote:While InXile would certainly like a large number of buyers, backers never really expected that which is why the game was backed on Kickstarter to begin with. InXile would do well to leave the price where it is and wait till after the 'Oom patch' to adjust pricing.
Indeed, ultimately the game has already been "paid for" by backers, so any additional sales are technically profit.
Dork Mage wrote:Translation was a mistake from the start. It is difficult to see how a million+ word game could be translated given that context is quite often not comprehensible for an average conversational translator. If each encounter is written like a film script - maybe. But as a novel, good luck. But then, InXile should have known this from WL2 which in comparison was a "simple" translation.
YUP. I assume that is why they hired Techland to do the translation stuff. In WL2 they tested the waters but as you said, it had a lot less words.
Torment was always going to be a huge job. I wonder just how expensive it was to get done.
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