The stretch-goals that are in and the ones are out?

For all Torment discussion that does not fit elsewhere. No spoilers allowed.

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Lord of Riva
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Re: The stretch-goals that are in and the ones are out?

Post by Lord of Riva » February 6th, 2017, 10:16 am

And 6 CNPC is more or less what we had in PsT. And same goes for limited choice of classes, only one thief (Annah) and one priest (Grace)

this is not PST though.

Sure I would preferred more CNPCs, but I do prefer more depth and reactivity on 6 CNPCs than 8-9 shallow CNPCs.

i would prefer 8-9 deep CNPCs actually.


Im not even disagreeing still both arguments are nonsensical. There are certainly arguments for both but there is no correlation at all to the game here.

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Re: The stretch-goals that are in and the ones are out?

Post by kilobug » February 6th, 2017, 11:06 am

Firkraag wrote:
kilobug wrote:I perfectly can understand the "being underwater" feeling
Could you explain, please?
It's a French expression, "être sous l'eau" (literally, "being under water") that means you've so many things to do and going on at once you can't tackle them all (and some, like communication here, just get de-facto ignored), that you've so many tasks to do it feels like you're drowning in them.

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Re: The stretch-goals that are in and the ones are out?

Post by Luckmann » February 6th, 2017, 11:14 am

kilobug wrote:While you're right on the lack of communication (but they apologized, and having myself been involved in computer projects, I perfectly can understand the "being underwater" feeling), inXile has been clear since the beginning that in TTON in particular, they would favor quality and depth to quantity. And 6 CNPC is more or less what we had in PsT. And same goes for limited choice of classes, only one thief (Annah) and one priest (Grace). So there is nothing shocking or outrageous for a Torment game there. Sure I would preferred more CNPCs, but I do prefer more depth and reactivity on 6 CNPCs than 8-9 shallow CNPCs.
First of all, if you're "being underwater", you're doing things wrong as a company; especially if you're one that depends on your fans and have crowdfunded your project. This is in no way an excuse. I realize that they've apologized, but it rings extremely hollow considering that this apology, had it not been dragged out of them due to fans realizing the extent of the cuts and exactly what things had been cut, there is no indication whatsoever that they would've told us before release - and post-release, it wouldn't have mattered to them anymore, having essentially deceived a mass amount of people that are suddenly realizing that they've been had.

Second, the "quality over quantity" argument doesn't hold water. You could argue this with absolutely anything, but it's an absurd idea that just because you can make something marginally better, you should cut other things that relate to it in one way or another. You could have the shiniest, most well-crafted piston in the world, but it's not going to do you any good unless you've got all the necessary ones for a good engine. Quantity has a quality all of it's own, and even with 9 (8) CNPC:s, the options would've been extremely limited. With this argument, why have a party at all? By that logic, we should be able to pool all efforts into a single character - the main character, since that is also preset in Tides of Numenera! Genius!

Referencing PS:T in this regard is also not just irrelevant, but does the argument no service, because the number of CNPC:s in PS:T was honestly one of the game's absolutely weakest points, and it was practically impossible to create anything resembling themed party compositions. You always ended up with roughly the same set of people, playing out in roughly the same way, exchanging maybe 1 or 2 (or less, considering you always wanted to cover a number of bases).
kilobug wrote:Very likely not, they probably had some hope to "rescue" part of those in 2016. If you look at previous CRPGs and how many nearly finished quests and area can be restored with a "simple" fan-made patch, cuts at the last minute are pretty much common.
It is true that some content in some games are cut extremely close to release. That is not the case in this. We're talking major CNPC:s intended to be integrated into a game world, the entirety of a 2nd major city, and long-term deals for localization that takes months to complete. This being cut this late is not supported by the information gathered by looking at the game files, and this is not the kind of stuff that gets cut at the end, this is storyboarded, considered and/or ironed out relatively early on - and the game has still been massively delayed at least twice, suggesting that to even get the planned stuff in, they needed extra time and funding. To try to defend inXile in covering this up is just absurd.

It's indefensible, and it's something we'd shrug at when it comes to Bioware/Electronic Arts or Ubisoft - not inXile or even Obsidian. That's why people are upset, and they've got every right to be.
“The pessimist complains about the wind;
the optimist expects it to change;
the realist adjusts the sails.”

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Grotesque
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Re: The stretch-goals that are in and the ones are out?

Post by Grotesque » February 13th, 2017, 1:38 am

Image
Bugs can be fixed but shitty design is forever.

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Re: The stretch-goals that are in and the ones are out?

Post by Kulin » February 15th, 2017, 3:43 am

This is very strange. So many things cut out while the invested Pledges are still rising. They are now 0.6 Million $ higher than the Kickstarter campaign and have been supported by an unknown amount of steam sales. If its really done to cut costs that's a pretty huge miscalculation. I would have expected that this would lead to more content, instead to less. :(

According to this thread there could be even more important cuts and gameplay simplifications:

viewtopic.php?f=46&t=17087

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Re: The stretch-goals that are in and the ones are out?

Post by paultakeda » November 27th, 2017, 11:58 am

Au_I wrote:
January 28th, 2017, 9:30 am
Grotesque wrote:- Mark Morgan live orchestra music
We contacted Morgan about the soundtrack yesterday. If he answers, we'll inform you.
Who is "we" in this context?

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