Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 21st, 2013, 2:46 pm

Yeah the .88 Magnum "schoolslayer" is hilarious I would love to see that in the game as a unique gag item, Mad Max's Iconic shotgun pistol and a Beretta 9mm with a supressor would be other favorites, Tommy Gun, MP-40, G-11, M-249 SAW and Galil 5.56 AR,
oh and the Carl Gustav, so many favorite weapons, so little time, I hope there are enough enemies to go around!

I looked up that .50 BMG cal pistol, somone said it would penetrate 6 inches of steel, not a chance of it doing that, but it is a pretty cool weapon if impractical. Its a single shot and I imagine the muzzle blast and report would be punishing, your party would grow to hate you for it. LOL

Actually the Barrett .50 cal is a real beast to shoot as well, I was at a Machine gun shoot 2 years ago and the Barrett was the only weapon I didnt really want to shoot, even with plugs in it was deafening, strangely louder than the m-2 .50 cal Hvy Machine Gun which I had fired in the service.

Speaking of enemies, what do you think will make appearances, I would like to see
Mutant humans
Doomsday cultist, religious fanatics,
Human scum of various sorts including Nazi wannabe's, biker trash and road gangs, KKK, various insane psychotics
Giant bugs-Ants, roaches, Spiders, Scorpions, Wasps, Praying Mantis, Ant-Lions, Jerusalem Cricket, sand spiders,
robots-especially like a Terminator type
Giant snakes
Giant Lizards and Gila Monsters
something awful like "the Thing" from John Carpentars movie
Mutated Bears and Mountain Lion, and Wolves,
Landshark!
Lobstrosities! Giant Crabs, Sand dwelling Giant Land Octopus,
Giant porcupine
plague zombies

Suggestions

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Zombra
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Zombra » May 21st, 2013, 4:41 pm

We will probably see most of those enemy types, but that has nothing to do with Update #28 :)
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 22nd, 2013, 1:05 pm

Oh Bloody hell! Your absolutely 100% correct Zombra. Sorry. I get off topic easily. Do we have a page for enemies? Sorry I am new to this, I was looking for Fallout 4 (and hoping it wouldnt be like Fallout 3) and found this instead...which may be much better anyway! 8-)

I do like the idea of being able to use pistols from begining to end, especially if you build one Ranger as a Pistoleer/fast draw gunslinger type. Another needs to be a Sniper, probably a Heavy weapons expert and a Medic, a Scout as well maybe.


I have a ton of experience with firearms and I love rifles ( so I hope there is a wide variety of them) for very obvious reasons anything automatic is a hoot as well, but pistols have their uses, I hope we have Fallout style "called shots" and that terrain is destructible, and that we can dual wield pistols and maybe melee weapons.

It is good to hear that the Devs are learning from what came before in Fallout 1,2,Tactics and Silent Storm and Jagged Alliance, though I never played Jagged Alliance, talk on this board has made me consider getting it.

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Zombra » May 22nd, 2013, 4:13 pm

Felixg91 wrote:Oh Bloody hell! Your absolutely 100% correct Zombra. Sorry. I get off topic easily. Do we have a page for enemies?
No big swig. I'm not a moderator or anything. Don't be afraid to start a thread of your own! I don't know of an "enemies you want to see" thread yet. But remember - the writing for the game is pretty much done. A new enemy type would have to be pretty incredible for them to stick it in at this point.
Sorry I am new to this, I was looking for Fallout 4 (and hoping it wouldnt be like Fallout 3) and found this instead...which may be much better anyway! 8-)
"Fallout 4" would be great, but yes, Wasteland 2 is a horse of a different color ... and yes, some of us think it will be even better than F4 would be 8-)

I'm still hoping that cyan will be part of that different color ...
I do like the idea of being able to use pistols from begining to end, especially if you build one Ranger as a Pistoleer/fast draw gunslinger type. Another needs to be a Sniper, probably a Heavy weapons expert and a Medic, a Scout as well maybe.
Yeah, that party would work well, but it's not the only team build you can have - which is kind of the point of making all weapons types viable. Personally, I'm planning to have [1] Rifle/Shotgun specialist; [2] Brawling specialist; [3] Demolitions specialist; [4] Stealthy medic with a knife. I'm sure those characters will evolve into different roles as I learn the game, but we'll see how things work out!
I hope we have Fallout style "called shots" and that terrain is destructible, and that we can dual wield pistols and maybe melee weapons.
Hmm. I'm not sure there'll be any of that. It's been argued that called shots don't add much to gameplay (by the end of the game you're just shooting for the eyes every time anyway). Destructible terrain requires a big investment of development resources for an arguably small return. And real life weapon enthusiasts seem to agree that dual wielding guns is strictly for the movies; serious combatants never do it.
It is good to hear that the Devs are learning from what came before in Fallout 1,2,Tactics and Silent Storm and Jagged Alliance, though I never played Jagged Alliance, talk on this board has made me consider getting it.
The Jagged Alliance series is excellent ... though it may be kind of dated for someone who's never tried it. Whatever you do, don't start with the new one (Back in Action).
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by GodComplex » May 22nd, 2013, 5:51 pm

Zombra wrote: And real life weapon enthusiasts seem to agree that dual wielding guns is strictly for the movies; serious combatants never do it.
Not to pick on ya, but CoD players are not representative of the populace. It's a well known fact that all people who are awesome dual wield.
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 22nd, 2013, 6:03 pm

Yeah to tell the truth dual wielding is cinematic, and I definately have never fired more than one weapon at a time, but I mentioned it because it LOOKS cool...games can get away with rule of cool just like movies and books. and I also like the idea of having a sword in one hand and a pistol in the other, or two melee weapons.

I for one wouldnt have included a twin barrel welded together SMG, that sounds like a hoaky weapon, I would have chosen to put in something more...maybe... useful, realistic and just better. It would be heavy, unwieldy and difficult to understand the need for it. I am okay with some silliness so I wont begrudge it too much and who knows maybe I will fall in love with it. That said I never agreed with miniguns in Fallout/Fallout 2 either and I never use em when playing those games.

the Boys .55 caliber AT rifle will be fun, that thing is a collar-bone breaker, I question where it would come from they are rare and the only people who used them ( and only in the early days of WW2) were a few units of Marines,on this side of the pond anyway. AT rifles wont kill tanks so maybe they will be good against Robots, large creatures, and power armor.


the update doesnt mention much if anything about being able to customise weapons, sights, suppressors, flashlights, folding stocks, folding bipods, bayonets,under slung grenade launchers, perhaps thats not really inthe cards although I hope it would be to some extent.

I am glad they at least mention grenade and Rocket launchers hopefully there are several types of both!

Good point about called shots, in truth best policy is to aim center mass.


Destructible terrain, maybe isnt that great, but being able to shoot through things is still something I would like.

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by GodComplex » May 22nd, 2013, 6:30 pm

Felixg91 wrote:I for one wouldnt have included a twin barrel welded together SMG, that sounds like a hoaky weapon, I would have chosen to put in something more...maybe... useful, realistic and just better. It would be heavy, unwieldy and difficult to understand the need for it. I am okay with some silliness so I wont begrudge it too much and who knows maybe I will fall in love with it. That said I never agreed with miniguns in Fallout/Fallout 2 either and I never use em when playing those games..
Did you have your sense of fun surgically removed? Not every game needs to be played like an army sim.
Felixg91 wrote:the Boys .55 caliber AT rifle will be fun, that thing is a collar-bone breaker, I question where it would come from they are rare and the only people who used them ( and only in the early days of WW2) were a few units of Marines,on this side of the pond anyway. AT rifles wont kill tanks so maybe they will be good against Robots, large creatures, and power armor.
Well one of the local gun shop owners here had one that he re-chambered for .50 bmg, so they are around, just like the occasional Lahti. Besides, in universe with power armor you get to develop big guns as using a dinky little carbine is kinda silly when you can shoulder fire a 20mm.
1/3 of my brain says blue radiation might be cool
1/3 says stop being overcritical
1/3 says a Baby Ruth could have prevented this situation
~Damoriel

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 22nd, 2013, 8:35 pm

Well Godcomplex any kind of gun is just fun period 8-) , for practicality I have my favorites and I have lots of experience with weapons, I was one of Uncle Sams Misguided Children. Some habits dont wear off. I would like to see what the welded together SMG looks like, form follows function. I might have proposed a double barrel semi-auto 12 ga. shotgun if I was gonna put in my 2 cents for welded together firearms, and if I didnt have to lug it around in the real world.

Yeah I have seen a total of 2 Boys AT rifles outside of museums and both had been rechambered, .55 ammo isnt common. Matter of fact there was one at the Machine gun shoot and there was a Lahti 20MM there as well, I personally think the Lahti is a cooler weapon and I had already thought they would be just the thing for a Ranger in Power Armor, I also just read the wiki on the Boys, apparently like 62000 of them were manufactured and though they proved nearly useless against any sort of more developed tank( this I knew as were most AT rifles) they, apparently were used as Sniper rifles in Korea ( this I did not), and were of some use against APC's and unarmored vehicles, kinda getting enthusiastic about AT rifles now.

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by GodComplex » May 22nd, 2013, 9:16 pm

Felixg91 wrote:Well Godcomplex any kind of gun is just fun period 8-) , for practicality I have my favorites and I have lots of experience with weapons, I was one of Uncle Sams Misguided Children. Some habits dont wear off. I would like to see what the welded together SMG looks like, form follows function. I might have proposed a double barrel semi-auto 12 ga. shotgun if I was gonna put in my 2 cents for welded together firearms, and if I didnt have to lug it around in the real world.
See I think the part of Wasteland that really appeals me is the impracticality of it all. I miss the absurdity that Wolfenstein and Doom gave us. Is a chainsaw practical weapon? Is it an effective weapon against cybernetically enhanced demons? Probably not, but I sure enjoyed the hell out of it. It just sort of wears on me that all games that have a shooting component all have the same mix. Pistol, shotgun, machinegun, sniper rifle, and silenced rifle. Where are the full auto nail guns, the 3 barreled riot shotguns, the saw blade throwers, and the napalm cannons of yore? I just feel that Wasteland embraces the insanity that dwells in the hearts of humans, the mad scientist in all of us that says "what if i made this really big?" I think the twin linked uzi is perfect, because out there in the wastes exists some mad man who thought that would be a good idea.

And as a side note, look up the Remington 1740 project and tell me there isn't part of you that wants that in the gun safe.

Edit: Another side note, when Chesty Puller was first shown a flame thrower he simply asked "where does the bayonet go?" So practicality be damned.
1/3 of my brain says blue radiation might be cool
1/3 says stop being overcritical
1/3 says a Baby Ruth could have prevented this situation
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Wile » May 22nd, 2013, 11:37 pm

GodComplex wrote: See I think the part of Wasteland that really appeals me is the impracticality of it all. I miss the absurdity that Wolfenstein and Doom gave us. Is a chainsaw practical weapon? Is it an effective weapon against cybernetically enhanced demons? Probably not, but I sure enjoyed the hell out of it. It just sort of wears on me that all games that have a shooting component all have the same mix. Pistol, shotgun, machinegun, sniper rifle, and silenced rifle. Where are the full auto nail guns, the 3 barreled riot shotguns, the saw blade throwers, and the napalm cannons of yore? I just feel that Wasteland embraces the insanity that dwells in the hearts of humans, the mad scientist in all of us that says "what if i made this really big?" I think the twin linked uzi is perfect, because out there in the wastes exists some mad man who thought that would be a good idea.

And as a side note, look up the Remington 1740 project and tell me there isn't part of you that wants that in the gun safe.

Edit: Another side note, when Chesty Puller was first shown a flame thrower he simply asked "where does the bayonet go?" So practicality be damned.
Yes! Too bad, that now days everything needs to be "realistic". Which of course means that every gun out there is some AR-15 variant, covered in picatinny rail, has vertical foregrip, red dot, laser sight, grenade launcher and what not... And what the hell is that two weapon limit every shooter now has? BORING! Flak Cannon from Unreal was and is awesomeness! As was Eightball, GES Biorifle and the rest! While realistic weapons have teir time and place, but screw 'em in Wasteland! I'd really want me some awesomeness incarnate, so I can go and tear people apart!

Oh, and shooting pistols akimbo is great fun, as is shooting PKM in standing position. Unpractical? Yes. Fun and cool? Oh, yeah!

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Zombra » May 23rd, 2013, 12:11 am

GodComplex wrote:
Zombra wrote: And real life weapon enthusiasts seem to agree that dual wielding guns is strictly for the movies; serious combatants never do it.
Not to pick on ya, but CoD players are not representative of the populace. It's a well known fact that all people who are awesome dual wield.
Don't worry about picking on me :)
But CoD players is not where I got my information. Not a big enough deal to quibble over though.

I will say that, to me, dual wielding falls under a different kind of cool than Wasteland weirdness. I mean, the Matrix is cool, and Harry Potter is cool, but ninja flipping preteen wizards don't necessarily belong in this game, you know? Neither the Antonio Banderas style of dual wielding nor the Chow Yun-Fat dual style of dual wielding seem appropriate here. The weapons may be weird, but the characters should take themselves seriously when firing them. One zebra's opinion.
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by ffordesoon » May 23rd, 2013, 12:23 pm

What are you talking about? Ninja-flipping preteen wizards belong in ALL GAMES EVER.
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 23rd, 2013, 2:37 pm

I am all for flavor in a game, Fallout had its .223 pistol ( the gun from the Movie Blade Runner) but I cant think of anything else really unique or incredibly creative, so I may not love the SMG but I am looking forward to discovering and at least trialing every weapon in the game. WIth what Devin wrote it seems there will be many weapons, I always felt Fallout didnt have enough Weapons and some of those included seemed odd choices, the FN-FAL and the Assault Rifle, should have been the Ak and M-16 instead but it is an alternate earth so its not really that bad.

Not sure how magic and Ninja's would even fit in Wasteland but I am sure they wouldnt fit in fallout.

WIll there be Psionics? Was there Psionics in the original? Any thoughts on that? I havent read all tthe updates where are they found, please?

I never played the original Wasteland, but I like the way that world sounds, the game engine is obviously very dated but the screenshots of Wasteland 2 look very good.

And I read again what Devin posted and so there will be at least some customization of weapons which I am really glad to hear I wanted more of that in Fallout, and more than only one per weapon, scope, folding stock, sling, bayonet, Suppressor, flashlight, laser, C-mag and underslung Grenade Launcher, bipod,....all the bells and whistles! ANd it would probably still weigh less than the welded together SMG!

Picatinny rails were invented in the early 1980's so they could just wiggle in, though they really didnt become common until later.

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Zombra » May 23rd, 2013, 3:00 pm

Felixg91 wrote:WIll there be Psionics? Was there Psionics in the original? Any thoughts on that? I havent read all tthe updates where are they found, please?
Seriously, you should make a new thread titled "Felix's Crazy Questions". I think we would have a lot of fun in there :lol:
Not sure how magic and Ninja's would even fit in Wasteland but I am sure they wouldnt fit in fallout.
They wouldn't fit in Wasteland; that was my point. Not EVERYTHING that is cool fits Wasteland, and I for one would prefer not to see dual wielding.

In my mind, the Wasteland approach to combat is harsh and serious, despite the hilarity of the text descriptions. The people in Wasteland are often appear weird and ridiculous, but their motives and survival instincts are sensible. In a John Woo movie, the characters are larger than life, and can afford to do stupid backflips and hold guns in their feet, because 10,000 bullets later, they know they'll still be fine. In a world like Wasteland, nobody would goof off by fighting with an ineffective style, because if you give the other guy an edge, you're food for the Rad Buzzards a second later.
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 23rd, 2013, 6:39 pm

:lol: I dont really want Psionics though...

Too cool Zombra! and your totally correct the remington 1740 looks like loads of fun, but it would be better if it was semi-auto. do you think thats in the game? Probably not though

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Zombra » May 23rd, 2013, 7:09 pm

Huh? I've never heard of the Rem 1740 before. But now that you mention it ... I'm into it :twisted:
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by GodComplex » May 23rd, 2013, 7:22 pm

Felixg91 wrote:And I read again what Devin posted and so there will be at least some customization of weapons which I am really glad to hear I wanted more of that in Fallout, and more than only one per weapon, scope, folding stock, sling, bayonet, Suppressor, flashlight, laser, C-mag and underslung Grenade Launcher, bipod,....all the bells and whistles! ANd it would probably still weigh less than the welded together SMG!

Picatinny rails were invented in the early 1980's so they could just wiggle in, though they really didnt become common until later.
In response to customization I present Ivan Chesnokov.
1/3 of my brain says blue radiation might be cool
1/3 says stop being overcritical
1/3 says a Baby Ruth could have prevented this situation
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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by sparkee666 » May 23rd, 2013, 7:33 pm

GodComplex wrote:In response to customization I present Ivan Chesnokov.
:lol: Russian gun philosophy is the best type of gun philosophy.

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 23rd, 2013, 7:47 pm

THats hilarious, I like this guy already :lol: thanks for that Sparkee!

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Re: Update #28: In the Wasteland, it's all "Self-Defense"

Post by Felixg91 » May 23rd, 2013, 8:08 pm

oh and GOdcomplex sorry wrongly attributed laughs.

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